Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles • Hacker News Board

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#591

Post by SECProto » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:32 PM UTC

infecto wrote: post #575

raydev wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ignoring the radio and focusing only on airflow controls: I dearly miss the console in my base model 2006 Yaris. It had 3 Fisher Price-sized knobs that I never had to look at when switching from feet/defog/face, changing temperature, and fan speed. It never stressed me, and each position on the knob had a satisfying clunk. I "upgraded" to a 2017 Subaru and the air controls are laid out with completely flat, indistinc…

I have a 08 Yaris Hatchback...best controls ever. And yes those knobs make the clunk feel and noise....I love it.

The whole air system in the Yaris is great. I recently left my car sitting for a while, and a chipmunk made a nest with the cabin air filter material. I looked under the glove box, unscrewed three Phillips head screws to drop the blower, cleaned it all out and screwed it back in. No messing around with body panels or other parts that were in the way, no custom or odd-size connectors. A mechanically simple system, easy to access and maintain.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#592

Post by mikelward » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:34 PM UTC

RankingMember wrote: post #503

mikelward wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in the CR-V they didn't. The entertainment system is an underpowered Android tablet. Lots of questionable decisions like the keyless lock system not locking if the tailgate was closing as you walk away, there being no way to turn the car off but leave the radio or AC on, and the engine cutting out as you try to drive off if you started it via remote start.

Your "no way to turn the car off but leave the radio or AC on" complaint doesn't make sense to me, as the AC compressor is powered by the engine's accessory drive belt, which won't turn if the engine's off. Otherwise, those sound like fair complaints. I'd add that Honda tried to go to a touch-based volume control in 2015/2016 and it was universally panned for its poor responsiveness and requirement that users take th…

The volume control is fairly good in the 2018 model. There's a dial on the head unit, and a strange-but-fairly-effective touch sensitive volume control on the steering wheel.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#593

Post by ConceptJunkie » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:34 PM UTC

alistairSH wrote: post #376

ubermonkey wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>As a User Experience Professional, I was never able to grasp the true user's need for touch screens in cars. Before phone integration, I might've agreed with you, or at least had no opinion on the subject. After watching many car companies, even high-end ones like BMW and Mercedes, fail utterly at producing reasonable phone integration systems or interfaces, though, I'm all-in on CarPlay. >It basically means they ha…

I own two cars with CarPlay, one use a touchscreen (VW) and the other a rotary knob/button (BMW). I much prefer the knob - with the touchscreen, I have to focus on the screen for a longer period of time to make sure my finger hits the right spot. With the rotary knob, I still have to glance over, but only enough to ensure the correct "button" is highlighted. That feels less distracting to me. All that said, I try to…

If you want choice and flexibility, don't live in a walled garden.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#594

Post by lawrencegs » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:35 PM UTC

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #491

cabinguy wrote: post #484

I remember when microwaves had one dial and no buttons, no digital touchscreens. You set the dial to the desired cook time in minutes/seconds, and it automatically started (as long as the door was closed). Same with an oven. Turn the dial to 350 and the oven was on and set to 350. It took a fraction of a second vs a touch screen. These new interfaces are often a terrible use of "technology" and are actually a step (o…

I remember those days - I liked our microwave with just a time knob and a start knob. But it had its drawbacks. My young children couldn't set the time to heat their oatmeal. "Turn it to 1 minute". They'd twist the knob and say "Is that enough?" Without knowing enough about time they couldn't (yet) figure out to turn right or left to get to the right number. With a digital one, they'd just poke 1,0,0 and hit start.

Young children behavior is interesting, I remember a friend whose 3 year old boy can’t read but fully capable of using his parents phone to watch Youtube. The boy constantly use Voice Recognition instead of keyboard input in such a fluid manner. After the search shows up, the boy simply pick the cartoon he liked.

Tap and swipe is first nature to him. What fascinates me is, this boy cant figure out how to turn on the tv because he keeps tapping amd swiping the remote control. I once saw him trying to swipe on the light switch as well.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#595

Post by Moru » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:36 PM UTC

Piskvorrr wrote: post #571

HeWhoLurksLate wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about physical buttons for the more-used stuff (radio, AC, cruise control) and use voice control (along with physical buttons) for everything else? Obviously, the voice control would need to havr some way to ignore the kids in the backseat, or can ask the driver / parent for permission for this to be a good idea.

The "obvious" problem is harder than it looks. Even searching in the navigation app gets confused by voice prompts from the same app ...so you get things like "find closest gas speed station check ahead". And that's before you get various people involved, never mind any impediments.

And speach is not as easy as a button / knobb for muscle memory. In my old car I didn't have to think, just do. A touchscreen just can't compete in a car.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#596

Post by xedeon » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:37 PM UTC

slfnflctd wrote: post #546

xedeon wrote: post #513

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're alluding to here is personal preference. If the Blackberry form factor is truly the best, people would still be buying them today. One of Steve Jobs's famous argument on this is that you can make the UI better over time on touchscreen interfaces compared to QWERTY based ones.

[most popular] != [best]|[fits all use cases]

> [most popular] != [best]|[fits all use cases]

I know you're trying to be snarky, but there is no product that "fits all use cases" because this implies that it's perfect.

Therefore, your pseudo code statement is inherently flawed. A perfect product or service simply does NOT exist. If it does, feel free to prove me wrong otherwise.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#597

Post by ronsor » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:38 PM UTC

josefresco wrote: post #534

How is a heads up display "accessible" for people with limited vision? In the web industry, we kill ourselves to make every color combination fully ADA compliant (in the US) and this involves a limited set of combinations. Not being familiar with the auto industry regulations (does ADA even apply?), I wonder how they (heads up displays) or even touchscreens could be considered accessible. Anyone have insight into how…

>In the web industry, we kill ourselves to make every color combination fully ADA compliant (in the US)

I've never found that to be true.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#598

Post by magduf » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:38 PM UTC

rjohnk wrote: post #582

coryfklein wrote: post #494

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No! I don't want everything automatic! What happens when the wiper sensor malfunctions - now you're scrambling to find the manual controls to shut the damn thing off (if you even can!) Maybe it wipes faster or slower than you prefer. Same thing goes for headlamps. For every "automatic" system you add to a vehicle, that is just one more thing that can malfunction and I find car repairs to be the most gigantic waste of…

While not directly related to buttons, recently my father ran into a deer, causing moderate damage to the front right bumper of his 2017 Suburban. It cost $5000 to repair due to all the sensors and technology. It would have been $1000 or less in a 1997 Suburban.

But when one of those sensors saves him from having a crash, or even saves his life, that $4k difference isn't worth even thinking about. Even a minor crash involving another car can cost well over $4k, after you consider how much your insurance rates are going to increase.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#599

Post by diminoten » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:39 PM UTC

rmrfchik wrote: post #156

diminoten wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are not the target audience for this feature, but that audience exists and it's gigantic.

As touchscreen interfaces and android auto integration creeps almost in EVERY car market, I can't be not target audience.

You seen to care deeply about your privacy, so no you aren't the target audience.

> And the last thing I need in my car is phone interface.

Not the target audience for the phone integration features...

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#600

Post by Zenst » Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 4:40 PM UTC

marapuru wrote: post #47

Praise to Mazda for making this decision. As a User Experience Professional, I was never able to grasp the true user's need for touch screens in cars. For years I have been working on product interfaces (not just apps). Many studies I conducted actually told me that people favored analog controls over digital touch screens controls. It gives you tactile feedback, making it accessible for anyone with sense of touch. >…

I totally agree. I recall the Blackberry with jog-wheel (non-touch screen), worked great, could scroll at a speed I liked, easy, one handed navigation of email, joy. Then they dropped that for the mini trackball, which they introduced with the pearl (a break into a consumer market). This was a mistake IMHO, and from a business users perspective, they sacrificed business users reaching for a consumer market that the likes of Apple did better.

Their again, many examples of not the best design happening as the consensus of public know how to use it. QWERTY keyboard layouts being classic example.

Then consoles and the mouse+keyboard combo over a game-controller pad. For FPS, mouse wins for ease of control still for me.

But the big takeaway for me about physical buttons over virtual touch-screen ones is the ability to leverage muscle memory. With physical buttons, you know were they are, how they feel and can do that without looking. Bit like sending a text from a nokia phone whilst it's in your coat pocket. Try doing that with a touch-screen based phone. Whilst not an everyday use, it does highlight the advantages of buttons in some uses.

Now, there is work ongoing in haptic feedback and some impressive work in the field of using ultrasound to create virtual surfaces you can feel. Which for many I'm sure will be great, but then the whole KISS design philosophy has somewhat taken a backseat in the name of features. But then, features are what sells many tech items today as they are still evolving. But there will always be people who prefer actual buttons. More so if you have ever been in a lift with a touch screen instead of buttons, which is something not to be sneezed at, literally unless you want to visit extra floors.