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Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

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Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#121

Post by max76 »

askmike wrote: post #109
ChainOfFools wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there seems to be a desire, arising from confusion and encouraged by opportunism, to conflate the term cryptocurrency with conventional notions of electronic cash. I've listened to people from the world bank, the IDB and at least one representative of a central bank explain to me with enthusiasm how their pet crypto and blockchain projects were creating new opportunities for their organizations. There's always some c…

Having done different projects both in the public and private blockchain space, I believe the majority of the confusion comes from almost no one actually understanding the point of something like Bitcoin. While it's clear for IT people to look at a Paypal like system and point to the obvious central point of failure (the company behind it, the website "paypal.com', etc), almost no one outside of IT understands decent…

> almost no one outside of IT understands decentralization and why someone would want it

I've talked to economist and political scientist that understood the implications of trading without central banks very well.

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#122

Post by skohan »

runeks wrote: post #102

> It has been a decade since bitcoin was born, yet consumers hardly use it—or the hundreds of other cryptocurrencies—to pay for things. And why would they? Adding two extra steps to paying someone -- the buyer converting local currency to bitcoin, and then the seller converting bitcoin to local currency -- can never compete with just transferring local currency directly. Cryptocurrency was meant to be much more than…

As someone with a split existence between North America and the Euro Zone, I was sincerely hoping that cryptocurrency would at a minimum be a reliable medium of exchange: i.e. a way to convert dollars into euros and vice-versa in a matter of minutes with very low fees. I never needed it to be an investment vehicle.

Unfortunately, bitcoin's utility in that respect seems to have gotten worse since I was playing around with it 5 years ago. I haven't been following recently so maybe it's changed, but during the bubble there was a move towards high fees and less liquidity, with plenty of horror stories of exchanges locking people out of their wallets during big price moves.

IMO bitcoin would be much more useful if it had remained a niche tool for people to buy drugs on the internet rather than the pure speculative instrument it seems to have turned into.

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#123

Post by colechristensen »

jhabdas wrote: post #116
colechristensen wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At that point and in so many circumstances the crypto part is ultimately just a different kind of database. Databases and protocols are just boring... At least from the perspective of the person using the currency. In general, who cares how Chase keeps track of my checking account? It might have this feature or that feature but when it is being used as it is there isn't much to be excited about. If you're Chase it mi…

Who cares? You should. Bitcoin offers a public audit trail less commonly known as triple-entry bookkeeping or momentum accounting. Chase still uses double entry. What's more Chase charges $25 per month to keep an open checking account, keeps only a small portion of your funds on hand and may both lock you out of your account and freeze your funds on a whim whereas Bitcoin won't.

I'd rather not have the entire planet be able to audit my transactions.

I don't care what Chase does with my dollars because the promise isn't that there's a vault somewhere that a banker can point to a pile of bills and say "that's Cole's money right there." The promise is that at any time I can withdraw any amount of money, and o have no problem believing that promise.

As for locking my account on a whim, that's what I signed up for. Every time so far I have had a financial account locked it has been because someone who wasn't me was trying to use my money. As for avoiding being punished for crime well I'm not too into money laundering so I think I'll be ok. Otherwise it's balancing the risk that the bank will make a fixable mistake with the existing system which has the ability to fix errors and reverse thefts.

The public audit trail has yet to return thousands of my dollars from mtgox. I bet if there was massive fraud and or theft of the reserves at Chase that I would have had my money back immediately.

(I don't actually have a checking account at Chase)

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#124

Post by yesforwhat »

superkuh wrote: post #17

Is it really a cryptocurrency when it's completely centralized? No. This is just Facebook-bucks. Store dollars. It's has absolutely none of the benefits of a real cryptocurrency.

> Is it really a cryptocurrency when it's completely centralized? No.

What is decentralized about a handful of Chinese miners controlling all supply?

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#126

Post by extropy »

yesforwhat wrote: post #124
superkuh wrote: post #17

Is it really a cryptocurrency when it's completely centralized? No. This is just Facebook-bucks. Store dollars. It's has absolutely none of the benefits of a real cryptocurrency.

> Is it really a cryptocurrency when it's completely centralized? No. What is decentralized about a handful of Chinese miners controlling all supply?

That there is a well established (if expensive) method to re-take the decentralized control should things go south.

Same for open source software, the best pieces are generally run by a no-nonsense autocrats.

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#127

Post by askmike »

max76 wrote: post #121
askmike wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having done different projects both in the public and private blockchain space, I believe the majority of the confusion comes from almost no one actually understanding the point of something like Bitcoin. While it's clear for IT people to look at a Paypal like system and point to the obvious central point of failure (the company behind it, the website "paypal.com', etc), almost no one outside of IT understands decent…

> almost no one outside of IT understands decentralization and why someone would want it I've talked to economist and political scientist that understood the implications of trading without central banks very well.

Good point. I was wrong in generalizing it into "IT people". Nevertheless the amount of people who get the pros of decentralization is too small.

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#128

Post by mtmail »

max76 wrote: post #119
pjc50 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Facebook-bucks Missed opportunity to call them "Marks", although maybe only German speakers will get the joke.

Is this a joke about fiat currencies and their tendency to suddenly become valueless and cryptocurrencies tendency to suddenly become valueless by making a cross language pun connecting the owner of a new cryptocurrency and the name of a currency most famously known for a hyperinflation.

Papiermark (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Papiermark) pre 1924 was the hyperinflated currency, then followed the stable Reichsmark and after World War II Deutsch Mark and East Deutsch Mark. Deutsch Mark remained until 2002 when the Euro got introduced. For Germans Mark is just a name for currency like Kronas (Sweden), Francs (France), Lira (Italy). Hyperinflation is too long ago to remember.

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#129

Post by ulfw »

xwdv wrote: post #33

IMO this is it, the last best chance for a cryptocurrency to take off and actually be used as a currency and not a speculative vehicle. If Libra fails, even with all of Facebook’s resources at its disposal, then there is unlikely to be any viable cryptocurrency for at least another generation. Disclaimer: I hold a lot of stock in FB and no positions in other crypto.

and what on earth would be the advantage of paying in Facebook Marks instead of US Dollars?

Re: Facebook’s New Cryptocurrency Gets Big Backers

#130

Post by Terretta »

pjc50 wrote: post #115
superkuh wrote: post #17

Is it really a cryptocurrency when it's completely centralized? No. This is just Facebook-bucks. Store dollars. It's has absolutely none of the benefits of a real cryptocurrency.

> Facebook-bucks Missed opportunity to call them "Marks", although maybe only German speakers will get the joke.

Get it but “Facebook Zucks” has a doubly tongue in cheek ring to it.
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