Google also proposes a new toggle switch control element for html. A lot of new stuff coming from Google. Will Safari and Firefox give up?
https://discourse.wicg.io/t/proposal-a-toggle-switch-control...
Introducing a new HTML element – welcome
21–30 of 234 posts
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#22With some UIs on the modern web, I’d love for clippy to appear and tell me what to do
A familiar face in this brave new world of hamburger menus and hieroglyphs!
Reminds me of this music video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4taIpALfAo
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#23Clippy html tag for animated virtual assistant. That's cool.
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#24The person writing this has to repeat frequently that they're OK with the element; it's quite funny how hard they try not to upset people. But their view of the situation is completely correct; just because this one feature might be useful (heck, when Microsoft dumped XMLHttpRequest on us that was incredible too), doesn't change the fact that we're now living in a web where Google does whatever it wants, adds whateve…
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Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#25The person writing this has to repeat frequently that they're OK with the element; it's quite funny how hard they try not to upset people. But their view of the situation is completely correct; just because this one feature might be useful (heck, when Microsoft dumped XMLHttpRequest on us that was incredible too), doesn't change the fact that we're now living in a web where Google does whatever it wants, adds whateve…
There is a difference though: when Firefox was launched, it was still possible to develop a browser from scratch (like Opera was doing back then), and hence lively competition. Nowadays, with WHATWG HTML's feature creep (the HTML "living standard" spec alone weighing in at 1250 pages and 13.3 MB as a PDF, plus tens of CSS specs all over the place, and JavaScript a moving target), that's infeasible for even a nation-state budget.
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#26Note, this is a sarcastic opening to a serious proposal — that Google not dump elements into the WHATWG HTML spec without user discussion and use cases: The way Google has gone about this seems to be… 1. Ooh! I have a cool idea! 2. Other people in Google agree with me! 3. Other Google projects could benefit from this? 4. Let's stick it in Chrome! 5. Oh, guess we should tell the community what we're doing. He thinks m…
I don't see how toast is different from the countless proposals for new declarative UI HTML elements that have been submitted over the years, and ignored or withdrawn (such as menu/menuitem), other than it coming from Google (and maybe Google not wanting to expose that functionality via a JavaScript API?) The reasoning against new UI elements has always been the same - they're inessential when JavaScript is needed an…
> I don't see how toast is different from the countless proposals for new declarative UI HTML elements that have been submitted over the years
The difference is that if Google introduces a new tag and starts using it, then every other vendor must implement the tag, or the [potentially popular] applications that use it [made by Google] will simply not work.
That's not a power that "countless proposals for new declarative UI HTML elements" have.
> I think this incident should make it very clear to everyone that HTML as seen by "browser vendors" (Google) is a very different thing from HTML the markup language as used all over the world for personal, business, medical, legal, and cultural documents, and which demands community representation and participation.
Google is not a browser vendor; they do not sell web browsers. Google sell advertising, and it's absolutely critical to Google's future to get everyone on the only web browser that has crippled ad blocking and privacy capabilities.
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#27I guess Microsoft's attempt to use their superior marketshare to kill web standards back in the 90s is too long ago for the irony of this to resonate.
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#28Unlike the author, I do not think is a good idea. Elements are supposed to express semantics, but this just suggests behaviour. Not very descriptive behaviour either - since when does actual real-life toast smoothly rise and fall again? Possibly from the ceiling or coming in from the side?
Why not just call it ?
Or even better, don’t add anything - it’s surely just a that needs styling and animating with existing CSS and JS?
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#29Another thing that scares me is how few people are involved in these standards. You will always see the same two or three people in the discussion of every standard.
Re: Introducing a new HTML element – welcome <clippy>
#30Another thing that scares me is how few people are involved in these standards. You will always see the same two or three people in the discussion of every standard.
I agree. It is mostly the people who have employers rich enough to sponsor them. Or some very dedicated amateurs doing it out of passion.