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RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

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Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#81

Does this affect public cloud providers? Can it be used to obtain data from other VMs running on the same host?

Not sure if this attack is feasible cross VM as long as the memory is not deduped/over provisioned. You need to make sure the victim allocates memory between the attacker controlled memory. Edit: As long as the memory is not deduped on the VMs it should not be possible since it won't be interleaved

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#82
post #45
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also an idiom Alex Sotirov coined 10 years ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heap_feng_shui

Imagine if human beings could be vulnerable to such attacks. Someone sends you a video link, you watch it, you see weird shapes appearing and disappearing for a few minutes, then the next thing you know, you wake up in a bathtub full of ice-cubes with one of your kidneys stolen.

this is more or less how the TV show Chuck works, except in generally a positive capacity.

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a bit is more likely to flip when the bits above and below it have the opposite charge. ... To exploit this effect, we developed novel memory massaging techniques to carefully place the victim's secret data in the rows above and below the attacker's memory row. The secret data has to be duplicated, column aligned, and have a single unallocated row between it. Controlling the alignment of the secret data seems like…

> Edit: The strategy in the paper requires allocating a bunch of physical memory from all the small blocks so that memory allocation requests from a new process are allocated deterministically to a desired physical row. Honest question, because I'm not a security expert: can you do this without having already pwned your target to such a degree that this would be unnecessary?

Yes, you can do it from an unprivileged user account, potentially allowing you to read some data from a privileged user or OS process.

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#85
post #65

I want to find a way to run each application I use on its own machine so that memory attacks (like spectre/meltdown, etc.) are theoretically impossible. I still want to have a reasonable computing experience (e.g. copy + paste works and the experience is kind of like using one computer the normal way). Any ideas? I was thinking some kind of remote desktop setup with a bunch of cheap boxes, each running Linux, on a LA…

Run X on one box connected to your programs over SSH running on separate boxes?

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#86
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that possible without special hardware to detect EM radiation?

You usually need an antenna, yes. Does that matter?

it matters because if the hardware is difficult and expensive to obtain, an attack can be costly, and hence, won't affect the common man. Industrial espionage or state level espionage hardly changes for the common man, and since most of the hardware in use is by the common man, it's unlikely to get a real fix.

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#87

Why does every new attack have a homepage these days?

It kind of makes sense for all the fundamental hardware vulnerabilities.

For most software vulnerabilities, the main takeaway message for the layperson is "yesterday's release of TheThing fixes some bad stuff. Don't use old versions, update to the new release" and the details matter only for the specialists.

For attacks like Rowhammer or Meltdown or Spectre or this one, however, there's lots of information that's still going to be relevant years after the publication - many people will have vulnerable hardware that will stay vulnerable, and you can still buy vulnerable hardware and so need to evaluate if your situation requires specific hardware choices to avoid these vulnerabilities, etc. So a long-term informative website is pretty much necessary.

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real-world side channels are going to start getting more attention as the technology and techniques for extracting information from EM radiation from circuits (not radios) leaking state improve.

>technology and techniques for extracting information from EM radiation Whats known to the public, you mean. I suspect even the nuttier conspiracy theorists don't have a solid grasp of just what capabilities might exist among well funded secret institutions.

There have been many demos at security conferences of doing these kinds of things, "simple" things like key logging from a laptop with only a nearby radio.

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#89
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real-world side channels are going to start getting more attention as the technology and techniques for extracting information from EM radiation from circuits (not radios) leaking state improve.

Is that possible without special hardware to detect EM radiation?

Well "special hardware to detect EM radiation" is most often software-defined radios like HackRF or BladeRF among others down to TV reception dongles you can get for a few dollars (search for RTL-SDR)

Re: RAMBleed Attack – Reading Bits in Memory Without Accessing Them

#90
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You usually need an antenna, yes. Does that matter?

it matters because if the hardware is difficult and expensive to obtain, an attack can be costly, and hence, won't affect the common man. Industrial espionage or state level espionage hardly changes for the common man, and since most of the hardware in use is by the common man, it's unlikely to get a real fix.

There are demos of things being done with RTL-SDR dongles which cost less than a good lunch.
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