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Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

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Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#31
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From TFA: "The bill has exceptions: cetaceans can be kept in captivity if they're receiving care or rehabilitation after an injury, or for scientific research."

The scientific research loophole seems like a pretty big one.

Perhaps, but the Vancouver Aquarium had the belugas currently at Marineworld, and were prevented by municipal bylaw from allowing the them to breed (which was aimed at avoiding a different loophole where aquariums could maintain a captivity-bred beluga line for research purposes).

The aquarium argued it was a pure research program, and it was a legit research program that had been going on for decades at least, I think. But public opinion swung against them and they made arrangements to end their program. Mostly their position was untenable because the aquarium supports itself with visitor ticket prices and donations, and the simple sight of belugas doing neurotic laps in a relatively tiny tank was enough to cause ticket sales to drop once it was publicized that their living conditions were inhumane.

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#32

China is going to be so pissed. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/china-dolphins... This is political. I'm sure of it.

It’s very political.

The Trudeau gov’t is coming up for election soon and is polling quite poorly. The gov’t is saddled by a scandal involving interference with the Minister of Justice. Trudeau also mentioned a single use plastic ban yesterday.

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#33

"Monday's vote notably impacts Marineland, the Niagara Falls amusement park and zoo that is considered the last Canadian park committed to keeping cetaceans in captivity." Wow, so they passed a national law that essentially targets just a single park? How often does that happen anywhere? (I know the back story but I never knew Marineland was the only place... not saying this is wrong or right, just surprised)

It’s an election year in Canada and the race is close. Expect more feel good laws that don’t actually change much.

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if you get a couple of marine biologist on your books and pump out a few papers per year the party can continue?

You can't make them perform for entertainment regardless of the loophole used to keep them.

It's not hard to think of a couple of research questions that involve them performing tricks. You might as well invite people to watch the research as it happens.

(I'm not suggesting that they should do this, just that they will. "Research" can be an easily abused loophole. Just look at Japan and their whale "research".)

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#35
post #8

Is there evidence all these creatures dislike captivity and would prefer fending for themselves in the wild? Genuinely curious. Not that it means anything, but dolphins have always seemed happy in captivity so long as they are being cared for appropriately.

Upvoting because legit question offers an opportunity to inform.

Most whales have a natural range of thousands of miles over the course of a year. Keeping them in tanks, no matter how generous to our eyes, is the equivalent of keeping a human in a bathroom for their entire life—-with exactly as little stimulation or variety as that implies.

Another response observes that whales in captivity always develop at least some neurotic behaviours, and this is generally regarded as directly caused by the incredibly limited environment in which they spend their lives. At one time, the argument was made that having them perform for crowds was necessary to keep them from going crazy.

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#36

China is going to be so pissed. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/china-dolphins... This is political. I'm sure of it.

I fail to see the connection between whales and dolphins kept in captivity in China vs a law being passed in Canada

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#37
post #36

China is going to be so pissed. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/china-dolphins... This is political. I'm sure of it.

I fail to see the connection between whales and dolphins kept in captivity in China vs a law being passed in Canada

It's a Hacker news thing, anything political let's see what China is doing or blame China for something else.

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#39
post #21
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would it be anthropomorphism to consider such a slide out a suicide attempt?

Ric O'Barry, former trainer of the dolphins used for the 'Flipper' TV show (now animal rights activist) tells a story in the documentary 'The Cove' how one of the dolphins swam up to him one day, looked him in the eye, took a last breath and then sank to the bottom of the tank and died [1]. Given that dolphins have to make a conscious choice for every breath they take gives some indication for a conscious decision fo…

Reportedly also Peter, the dolphin in the Margaret Lovatt research in the 60's https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/jun/08/the-dolp...

Re: Canada to ban keeping whales, dolphins in captivity

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is not a matter of opinion that orca whales, bottlenose dolphins and beluga whales die prematurely when kept in captive settings, but rather a potent and recurring reality. Marino & Frohoff (2011) show that this is especially and most dramatically seen in the orca whale, with males living on average 29.2 years in the wild with an observed maximum of 60 years, and females living 50.2 years on average with an obse…

From the study that Marino & Frohoff (2011) cites for orca whale lifespan in the wild: > Using data from between 1973-4 and 1987, females have a mean life expectancy of 50.2 yr How is this possible? I don't understand how a 14 year observation window allows someone to observe an average life expectancy of 50 years.

Because they're able to tell how old the whale is when it died. They're not observing whales from birth to death in each instance. If you tried to do that, you'd be unable to speak on life expectancy on species with lifespans greater than like 10 years.
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