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Why Is America So Far Behind Europe on Digital Privacy?

nytimes.com

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Re: Why Is America So Far Behind Europe on Digital Privacy?

#61

Post by tilt_error »

braythwayt wrote: post #45
notacoward wrote: post #36

I think it all comes down to uniquely American cult of individualism, in two distinct streams that separate and then join together. The first is a general anti-regulatory attitude and distrust of government, assuming that those things are harmful to individual freedom even when they're anything but. The second is treating corporations as people. Put those together and you get a belief that the government shouldn't ti…

What if--And I'm just riffing here--what if America doesn't have nearly the cult of individualism that everybody seems to think it has? What if America has a strong authoritarian inclination, as seen by its extreme focus on patriotism and patriarchal style of Christianity? What if the "Uniquely American cult of individualism" is (a) Something Americans tell themselves in a "She doth protest too much" attempt to avoid…

...and you are backed up by the World Values Survey! [1]

[1] http://www.worldvaluessurvey.org/images/Culture_Map_2017_con...

Re: Why Is America So Far Behind Europe on Digital Privacy?

#62

Post by AnonymousPlanet »

tootahe45 wrote: post #6

When you have zero tech companies it's easier to do things that impede tech companies.

You mean tech as in internet based, I assume. Technology (in the actual sense of the word) based companies make Germany an economical powerhouse.

The large european companies with a big "stake" in the internet are non-technology based companies like publishers. These publishers hate the internet and they hate Google and Facebook because they see them as competition.

The result is shenanigans like Article 13. Also, the GDPR, with its anti Google and Facebook overtones, has received nearly nothing but applause from these stakeholders. So friction was light when it was pushed through by people who actually cared for the privacy aspects of it.

Re: Why Is America So Far Behind Europe on Digital Privacy?

#63

Post by anoncake »

andrenth wrote: post #58
anoncake wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a non sequitur. Demand is orthogonal to value. Heroin isn't valuable to society yet it exists.

There is no demand for things that have no value. The customers of the companies mentioned above obviously see some value in using their services, otherwise they wouldn’t do so. You seem to be using “is valuable” to mean “is good for”. I’m using it in the economic sense.

I'm not using it in the economic sense because that's not what the conversation is about.

Re: Why Is America So Far Behind Europe on Digital Privacy?

#64

Post by shdh »

throwaway479089 wrote: post #37
tootahe45 wrote: post #6

When you have zero tech companies it's easier to do things that impede tech companies.

We do have tech companies but we don't let them grow beyond reason and extend their tentacular grip on almost all areas of society. Are you implying it's a bad thing?

Regardless of regulations that still doesn't counter the prevalence of American companies in Europe.

Re: Why Is America So Far Behind Europe on Digital Privacy?

#66

Post by anoncake »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #60
anoncake wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you model individual States as "countries" conceptually, the political dynamics make a lot more sense. No, not at all. US states being somewhat like countries can't put the USA behind the EU. EU states are countries.

This distinction isn't nearly a bright line as you think it is, the US is essentially what happens when an EU-like structure has 200+ years to evolve. In the US, States have their own constitutions, legislatures, various legal systems, and almost complete autonomy with narrow exceptions. Around 30% of them operated autonomously as their own countries at various times. Americans have almost no contact with the Federal…

I don't think the line is that bright. AFAIK there are quite a few areas in which the EU is more centralized than the USA. The relationship between US states and the federal government does explain certain differences to the EU, sure. But not if you simplify it to "US states are like souvereign countries" because so are EU members. EU and USA cannot be different because of something they have in common.

> This is also why the US Federal government can't just "pass a law" to do things

In a way, it can do that by changing the constitution. That requires the consent of a majority of states, but this is common in federations. The EU cannot change its "constitution" at all except with the consensus of all members.

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