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Apple Is Listening

marco.org

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Re: Apple Is Listening

#121

Post by imagetic »

overgard wrote: post #66
scarface74 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get an equivalent Windows computer for $8000 less than a Mac Pro + Apple display? You know no one is forcing you to buy the Apple display right?

Yes, I can easily get a computer for 4K that rivals a Mac Pro. I think like 4 years ago my employer let me spec out the computer I bought for 4K and I built a 20 core Xeon monstrosity with 32gb of ram, 3 monitors, and like a $700 Nvidia card. 4 years ago! If apple was listening to their customers they’d offer a customisable desktop tower in the 2-5k range people are willing to pay. As much as I like the iMacs display…

If they had done an 8-core i9'ish option with 64gb of RAM and an RTX card equivalent for $3500...I would hit the speed dial to my Apple sales rep.

Re: Apple Is Listening

#122

Post by leoc »

chipotle_coyote wrote: post #74
leoc wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lack of function keys is not unprecedented, though. Well into the '90s Macs generally didn't have any. What do you use them for?

I don't mind the lack of function keys; I've realized to my mild surprise that the only things I tend to use them with have been bits and bobs I remapped myself with Keyboard Maestro (I used to have F13 remapped to...something or other, for instance) and the occasional terminal app that uses function keys. I do use media keys, but I've found the Touch Bar is by and large just fine for that. (I don't really have muscl…

The lack of a mechanical Escape is nuts, yes. But Apple could and should have dealt with that by moving the Escape to somewhere else on the keyboard. In fact they should have done that anyway, as Escape is too remote on the far left of the far-away function row. Given the the MBP keyboard as it is, most users should probably remap Esc to the Caps Lock key, at least if they don't tend to hit Caps Lock by accident.

Re: Apple Is Listening

#123

Post by djmobley »

linguae wrote: post #28

I’m glad that Apple is finally updating their Macs again, but at the same time Apple has doubled-down on its refusal to sell user-serviceable, upgradeable, and expandable hardware at prices that are within reach for most customers. The laptops have soldered RAM and soldered storage. The Mac Mini and iMac Pro thankfully have DIMMs, but in order to keep the warranty, you have to visit an Apple-approved repair center to…

MacOS with regular PC hardware? Just build a Hackintosh.

It’s far easier than I thought it would be. Pick the right parts and it will work flawlessly.

Re: Apple Is Listening

#124

Post by chipotle_coyote »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #90
chipotle_coyote wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they probably felt they had to reveal it at this event for PR reasons, if nothing else; you're right in that this is clearly a machine made for A/V editors, but I can't see Apple introducing the new Mac Pro at NAB. A new Final Cut Pro, sure, but not a new Mac Pro. I think they dropped the ball by not having two displays, though -- the $6K Pro Display XDR for the crowd who goes "OMG that's so cheap for a monit…

> they dropped the ball by not having two displays, though As you said, they’re going for a specific market with this product. They can always release a general-market display down the road. Focusing on a specific set of power users first is how Apple built its renowned culture, and it’s nice to see it returning to those roots.

I see people downvoting this comment, but...it's kind of true.

The "kind of" part is this: Apple arguably built its culture first around the extremely hacker-friendly Apple II, then around the original Macintosh -- which was certainly expensive, but was very specifically pitched as "the computer for the rest of us." That segment is one that they're ironically a bit wobbly on right now. (The MacBook Air and the iMac are close.)

But: the Mac got adopted by the high end graphic design and print layout industry, and Apple started making higher end machines specifically targeted to that market like the Mac IIfx -- which was a $9K machine at its introduction in 1990, and that is not adjusted for inflation. As far as I can tell, that was their high water mark in pricing, but they've regularly had "flagship" models breaking the $4K mark at introduction, e.g., the Power Macintosh 9500. The sub-$3K flagship era of the Power Mac G5 and original Mac Pros is something of an anomaly. (Which isn't to say that I wouldn't like to see a headless Mac with internal expansion slots that starts at $1999.)

Re: Apple Is Listening

#126

Post by imagetic »

Apple took it to the max in terms of what IS possible with the Mac Pro. That's awesome.

I don't see any of the post-houses I work with on a regular basis chomping a the bit for the power they're offering at $6k though. Most have already switched to PC/Windows after Final Cut X and the Mac Pro trashcan came up very very VERY short.

This is definitely aimed at the highest budget niche audience. I'm sure a few very successful independent media people will buy them. I'll be jealous.

I've owned 3 Mac Pros in my life, but this breaks any budget I could possibly lay out for anything I have ever worked on in my entire career.

Re: Apple Is Listening

#127

Post by killjoywashere »

pryce wrote: post #96
1024core wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a vi user, I hate the touchbar and its escape "key". I sometimes find myself turning down the brightness instead of getting into command mode which is irritating.

I hear this specific complaint often; I wonder if people don't realize the hit area of the escape key is much larger than the key itself. On my 2016 MBP I can fire it from almost a centimeter from its left edge I do wish there was some haptic feedback, and all my issues would go. Touchbar has been great for scrubbing, provides much finder-grained control of both brightness and volume than the keys did (fine-grained s…

As a Vim user who occasionally uses a touchbar MacBook, I don't even think about the touchbar. Mainly because I don't use it for anything. Let me repeat that: nothing. It does not enter my mind. Until I hit escape and I'm still in text entry mode. Because the escape key didn't fire.

I appreciate the collaborator who sent this thing to me, so I have excellent field experience on which to base my decision to "nope, never" buy one of these.

Re: Apple Is Listening

#128

Post by oarsinsync »

djmobley wrote: post #123
linguae wrote: post #28

I’m glad that Apple is finally updating their Macs again, but at the same time Apple has doubled-down on its refusal to sell user-serviceable, upgradeable, and expandable hardware at prices that are within reach for most customers. The laptops have soldered RAM and soldered storage. The Mac Mini and iMac Pro thankfully have DIMMs, but in order to keep the warranty, you have to visit an Apple-approved repair center to…

MacOS with regular PC hardware? Just build a Hackintosh. It’s far easier than I thought it would be. Pick the right parts and it will work flawlessly.

Last I checked, you have to disable signature checking on kernel extensions. For some, having to trade off that level of security is a pretty big flaw.

Re: Apple Is Listening

#129

Post by newscracker »

linguae wrote: post #28

I’m glad that Apple is finally updating their Macs again, but at the same time Apple has doubled-down on its refusal to sell user-serviceable, upgradeable, and expandable hardware at prices that are within reach for most customers. The laptops have soldered RAM and soldered storage. The Mac Mini and iMac Pro thankfully have DIMMs, but in order to keep the warranty, you have to visit an Apple-approved repair center to…

I feel the same way. Macs have become more expensive and less friendly for upgrading RAM and storage, the two most important things that need to be user upgradeable for longevity and reducing e-waste (I don’t care much about CPU/GPU upgrades).

Even the new Mac mini is quite expensive compared to its predecessors. Mac mini used to be the cheap and beginner level entry into Macs/macOS. The current hardware may be worth the price, but Apple has clearly missed making something that’s a lot more affordable (with cheaper parts, fewer ports, etc.).

Re: Apple Is Listening

#130

Post by yborg »

analognoise wrote: post #71
overgard wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well you’re right, it isn’t for me. Which is exactly my point. I am their target market (user of creative software that’s willing to pay a bit of a premium), who has been willing to buy their computers in the past, and none of what they sell holds any appeal. It’s either ridiculously priced (Mac Pro), shoddy (MacBook) or not very modifiable (iMac) “The market” that it’s for (“creatives”) is saying things like “why ca…

FPGA developer here. Access to a Linux cluster at work, everyone has 96GB ECC ram, dual Xeon on win 10 as a backup in case of any issues or if they prefer running locally. Our badass computers were a hair over 10k a piece. I have no idea why anyone would pay what Apple is asking. I remember when it was "counterculture" to give people more compute, for less money - do real work, on machines that made financial sense -…

>Renting your office productivity suite for a monthly fee

Meanwhile Apple gives away a spreadsheet, presentation program, and a word processor for ... free. I guess with open source, et. al. that's the mainstream now? I frankly prefer this timeline.

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