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The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

volument.com

11–20 of 22 posts

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#12

This article comes across as being really fake. You can clearly tell that the goal is to to drive additional traffic to their v1.0001 instead of actually diving into what they did wrong. Were they really investigating an entire new DB and user interface in the few days after launch? If your initial design is so far off that it requires a complete rewrite on day 1 of launch, then you have serious problems. That is not…

> That is an architectural failure.

Let's not jump the guns too soon. Analytic products are notoriously hard from scaling perspective. UI, APIs, Infra that works crisply for 1x data, starts to become sluggish at 10x and really breaks down at 100x.

Startups solve the 100x scale problem when they get there (sensibly so). In this case, they got there way too quickly thanks to HN traffic.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#13

This article comes across as being really fake. You can clearly tell that the goal is to to drive additional traffic to their v1.0001 instead of actually diving into what they did wrong. Were they really investigating an entire new DB and user interface in the few days after launch? If your initial design is so far off that it requires a complete rewrite on day 1 of launch, then you have serious problems. That is not…

Yes. We really made a bad architectural decision and are now suffering from it. We thought the first version was good enough for the public eye.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#14

This article comes across as being really fake. You can clearly tell that the goal is to to drive additional traffic to their v1.0001 instead of actually diving into what they did wrong. Were they really investigating an entire new DB and user interface in the few days after launch? If your initial design is so far off that it requires a complete rewrite on day 1 of launch, then you have serious problems. That is not…

And... So it was a failure... So they redid the work.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#15

This article comes across as being really fake. You can clearly tell that the goal is to to drive additional traffic to their v1.0001 instead of actually diving into what they did wrong. Were they really investigating an entire new DB and user interface in the few days after launch? If your initial design is so far off that it requires a complete rewrite on day 1 of launch, then you have serious problems. That is not…

> That is an architectural failure. Let's not jump the guns too soon. Analytic products are notoriously hard from scaling perspective. UI, APIs, Infra that works crisply for 1x data, starts to become sluggish at 10x and really breaks down at 100x. Startups solve the 100x scale problem when they get there (sensibly so). In this case, they got there way too quickly thanks to HN traffic.

IMO, they probably failed way before 100x expected usage. It was probably before 10x expected usage. This isn’t crazy. This is a problem that happens for a lot of teams dealing with scale. You engineer for 1x (checking off requirements) and anything over that tears everything to shreds. The difference between developing a solution on your local and hitting your PERF environment is massive. e.g. I can’t run a TB DB on my local, so... if I don’t see queries running in less that 10ms-100ms, I basically know that the queries are never going to complete in PROD. Scale is hard.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#16
post #14

This article comes across as being really fake. You can clearly tell that the goal is to to drive additional traffic to their v1.0001 instead of actually diving into what they did wrong. Were they really investigating an entire new DB and user interface in the few days after launch? If your initial design is so far off that it requires a complete rewrite on day 1 of launch, then you have serious problems. That is not…

And... So it was a failure... So they redid the work.

Right, it's a good thing not a bad thing.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#17
I looked at your problem page and it's not true that Google Analytics bounce rate is not useful for single-page applications.

You can trigger events with JavaScript and choose whether they affect bounce rate, so you can manually trigger an event when the user scrolls down, clicks something, spends a few minutes on the site, etc. So your problems with the bounce rate metrics are just not true.

Also I saw you mention it doesn't track returning users, that's not true either. I can actually see insights into how many users return month after month, and it'll tell me what my activity is per channel and if one channel outperformed others, so it's pretty powerful in this regard for a free platform.

I skimmed it but from just reading those it sounds like you should try to get better familiarity with Google Analytics and talk to users to see what their main pain points with existing platforms are, as well as establish more concrete value propositions. Google Analytics is free after all, I'm not convinced yet to move to a paid platform that tries to address problems I'm not experiencing.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#18
post #2

I wanted to try Volument but I noticed that their website wasn't redirecting to https, they had set the HSTS header and forgot about http since they only ever saw https on their browsers. This put me off because I thought, if they got this wrong, who knows what else they got wrong? I emailed them and they replied very soon and fixed the problem within a day, though, so at least response time was excellent.

[deleted]

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#19
post #17

I looked at your problem page and it's not true that Google Analytics bounce rate is not useful for single-page applications. You can trigger events with JavaScript and choose whether they affect bounce rate, so you can manually trigger an event when the user scrolls down, clicks something, spends a few minutes on the site, etc. So your problems with the bounce rate metrics are just not true. Also I saw you mention i…

Google Analytics bounce rate isn't useful for single-page applications unless you monitor user activity with JavaScript and GA event tracking. Not everyone is aware of this and/or can do this. We should update the docs with regards to events.

GA can do retention reports or "cohort analysis" and show how visitors return in a monthly basis, but there are two critical limitations on it:

1) It doesn't show you which landing pages, target markets, or their combinations are retaining the most.

2) You can only study one metric by the time and not the total retention + conversions each segment generate, which should be the deciding factor

There is no initial interest, nor predictions either. So when doing a new campaign you cannot take any insights from cohort analysis until you wait for enough return visitor data.

We certainly agree that Google Analytics is an awesome tool and it has served our sites really well in the past. It gives tons of general insights for a free service, but isn't designed specifically for conversion optimization. Hence Volument.

Re: The pain of a successful Hacker News launch

#20

Cheers for shipping a product! I recall the post, and as a heavy Google Analytics user the landing page made some very salient points. This post was honest and challenges the fantasies of many hopeful hackers. "Catastrophic Success" is no joke. I can sympathize with the challenges of running a web scale analytics tool, after helping build and run an analytics stack for an ad network. Even with our relatively small gr…

Volument shows the size of each segment and doesn't generate any report unless the size is "sufficient". However, it doesn't reward bigger segments when calculating the score for traction.

Thank you for the solid feedback!

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