Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
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Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#2I wonder as far as education goes if graduating college, working, and then returning for a masters or similar things would be a better pattern. Or even graduating high school, working, college, working, college, or something else would be a better pattern.
I've worked with some folks with MBAs who have no clue about how to work with people / think they're just "the boss" and what they say goes because no reason at all. Worked with folks with CS degrees who I don't think really like to code / can't troubleshoot at all.
Front heavy education seems efficient on the surface, but I'm not sure makes sense without having a perspective on what life is like after that.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#3I wonder as far as education goes if graduating college, working, and then returning for a masters or similar things would be a better pattern. Or even graduating high school, working, college, working, college, or something else would be a better pattern. I've worked with some folks with MBAs who have no clue about how to work with people / think they're just "the boss" and what they say goes because no reason at al…
I really don't like the idea that education is a thing you do once in your late teens/early twenties and then finish. There are good reasons to do something then, but there's no good reason to stop.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#4I wonder as far as education goes if graduating college, working, and then returning for a masters or similar things would be a better pattern. Or even graduating high school, working, college, working, college, or something else would be a better pattern. I've worked with some folks with MBAs who have no clue about how to work with people / think they're just "the boss" and what they say goes because no reason at al…
I really don't like the idea that education is a thing you do once in your late teens/early twenties and then finish. There are good reasons to do something then, but there's no good reason to stop.
I changed careers via a bootcamp. I've got VERY mixed feelings on how that industry works...
But just the idea of going back to school to sort of "retool" or expand your toolset for 3 months full time, or 6 or something and get something worthwhile IMO could be the future. The question is if employers will support it.
Granted going back for a more traditional school experience could be a very legitimate route too.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#5I wonder as far as education goes if graduating college, working, and then returning for a masters or similar things would be a better pattern. Or even graduating high school, working, college, working, college, or something else would be a better pattern. I've worked with some folks with MBAs who have no clue about how to work with people / think they're just "the boss" and what they say goes because no reason at al…
Not by choice exactly I’ve done College -> Work -> Work/College -> Professional Job.
The first 6 months of my “real” career job in tech I learned almost as much as the first 2 years of college. I couldn’t imagine having a masters especially an MBA without having worked professionally, internships aside. I’m excluding the medical professions where the minimum to employment is a masters/doctorate. Even non-doctors have a lot of clinical/hospital experience before/during a masters.
I’m about to start looking at Masters or MBA programs in my area. I’ll have almost 10 years of experience by then and happy I didn’t do it straight after school.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#6I did school => work => now going back to school. Granted I didn’t study CS undergrad but taught myself a lot.
Since, I’ve learned and worked on some interesting problems. I want to work in big tech or in consulting. To do so, I need to be a lot better and/or have great grades.
So spending 2 years going back to school and improving seems worth it to me.
I have 0 student loans from undergrad and very minimal commitments as is.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#7Earlier quoted context omitted.
I really don't like the idea that education is a thing you do once in your late teens/early twenties and then finish. There are good reasons to do something then, but there's no good reason to stop.
I changed careers via a bootcamp. I've got VERY mixed feelings on how that industry works... But just the idea of going back to school to sort of "retool" or expand your toolset for 3 months full time, or 6 or something and get something worthwhile IMO could be the future. The question is if employers will support it. Granted going back for a more traditional school experience could be a very legitimate route too.
I don't like the bootcamp model. I also don't like what a lot of graduate programs have become, insofar as they're jockeying to become souped-up bootcamps by making ever more grand career promises while trying to minimize the amount of time it takes to earn a degree.
Just no. Schools shouldn't be selling jobs. They should be selling education.
To that end, what I really want to see is more schools than just community colleges allowing you to take classes without being enrolled in a degree program. Once upon a time I contacted a university to see about taking some additional classes to fill in some gaps I didn't manage to fill while I was getting my bachelor's, and they told me that I couldn't just take a few classes; I'd have to enroll in a bachelor's program, become a major in the school, and go through earning a second bachelor's degree in a field for which I already held a bachelor's, just to get access to one or two classes.
That's ridiculous. And anachronistic. It's a model that's designed for an era when postsecondary education was primarily reserved for children of a privileged elite class, and a very few people who were trying to break into the wealthy elite class. There's a huge gap between that model and what we actually need nowadays. In failing to adapt, the orthodox educational establishment is doing society a huge disservice, because the only other people to address it are a bunch of for-profit organizations who see the demand, first and foremost, as an arbitrage opportunity to exploit.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#8I wonder as far as education goes if graduating college, working, and then returning for a masters or similar things would be a better pattern. Or even graduating high school, working, college, working, college, or something else would be a better pattern. I've worked with some folks with MBAs who have no clue about how to work with people / think they're just "the boss" and what they say goes because no reason at al…
Not by choice exactly I’ve done College -> Work -> Work/College -> Professional Job. The first 6 months of my “real” career job in tech I learned almost as much as the first 2 years of college. I couldn’t imagine having a masters especially an MBA without having worked professionally, internships aside. I’m excluding the medical professions where the minimum to employment is a masters/doctorate. Even non-doctors have…
The good MBA programs basically require professional work experience at a reputable firm. Generally, you graduate perhaps at age 21 to 23, then work for a few years, then go get an MBA, and finish around 26 to 28.
Edit: See Wharton class stats, shows a mean work experience of 5 years.
https://mba.wharton.upenn.edu/class-profile/
MIT/Harvard/Stanford show similar:
https://mitsloan.mit.edu/mba/admissions/class-2020-profile
https://www.hbs.edu/mba/admissions/class-profile/Pages/defau...
https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/programs/mba/admission/class-pr...
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
I changed careers via a bootcamp. I've got VERY mixed feelings on how that industry works... But just the idea of going back to school to sort of "retool" or expand your toolset for 3 months full time, or 6 or something and get something worthwhile IMO could be the future. The question is if employers will support it. Granted going back for a more traditional school experience could be a very legitimate route too.
I don't like the bootcamp model. I also don't like what a lot of graduate programs have become, insofar as they're jockeying to become souped-up bootcamps by making ever more grand career promises while trying to minimize the amount of time it takes to earn a degree. Just no. Schools shouldn't be selling jobs. They should be selling education. To that end, what I really want to see is more schools than just community…
>Schools shouldn't be selling jobs. They should be selling education.
I think that is what we have now... the education is disconnected from the jobs in the sense that the price makes no sense.
I think a lot of what you describe is what happens when an education system thinks they're just selling "an education" without consideration that their student's are can't afford it.
Re: Biggest Offender in Outsize Debt: Master’s Degrees
#10Grad school really needs to have a cost/benefit analysis applied. I'd have loved to go and really deepen my understanding, but it's pretty clear that both in terms of income lost and not a huge premium paid by the industry over my BS and experience it's not worth it.
It is something I may pursue if I get a windfall and am no longer concerned about retirement.