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Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

nytimes.com

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Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#51

Post by cheerlessbog »

balfirevic wrote: post #17
elil17 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s really unrelated. I get that it seems analogous to you, but it’s weird to me that a cats claw is similar to a foreskin in your mind. Declawing is much more like cutting off the cats fingers

They are both bodily mutilation of powerless non-consenting beings/individuals. I wouldn't call that unrelated.

Isn't castration/spaying, too? Arguably that's in their own interest but we don't do it to non consenting humans so clearly there's different rules. Heck we keep them in captivity.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#52

Post by alexmlamb »

It's not exactly a quick fix, but how many generations would it take to breed cats with substantially softer claws? This could be an interesting program perhaps for the government to undertake.

I also wonder if crispr or embryo selection could be used if a GWAS could find genes that lead to softer claws.

The selection techniques have been used to improve milk yields for cows, so it seems like making cats which don't need to be declawed would be a valid project.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#53

Post by taeric »

vageli wrote: post #50
taeric wrote: post #48

I'm actually somewhat torn on this one. At face value, I fully agree. More, none of my cats have been declawed, as I just don't see the point. That said, I also don't buy the mutilation argument at face value. We literally castrated all of our male cats, and nobody bats an eye. Indeed, you seem to be frowned upon if you don't. Surely that is as mutilating to a male cat as losing a knuckle?

> I'm actually somewhat torn on this one. At face value, I fully agree. More, none of my cats have been declawed, as I just don't see the point. > That said, I also don't buy the mutilation argument at face value. We literally castrated all of our male cats, and nobody bats an eye. Indeed, you seem to be frowned upon if you don't. Surely that is as mutilating to a male cat as losing a knuckle? At least castration has…

Castration is a bit of a brute force for population control. No reason we couldn't also give cats vasectomies.

For the other, are there actual numbers on what that means for cats? Feels like an appeal to emotion, as much as anything else. Outdoor cats, I would presume, are far more likely to die from a car than from anything they can protect themselves from with front claws.

And again. I actually support the idea here. I just don't know if I have strong logic to stand on. I'd call it devil's advocate, but I'm not sure that is right.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#54

Post by balfirevic »

cheerlessbog wrote: post #51
balfirevic wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are both bodily mutilation of powerless non-consenting beings/individuals. I wouldn't call that unrelated.

Isn't castration/spaying, too? Arguably that's in their own interest but we don't do it to non consenting humans so clearly there's different rules. Heck we keep them in captivity.

It is. But rules are not arbitrarily different - they are, if anything, more protective of humans than cats. Which is why it's weird that declawing is not acceptable while circumcision is.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#55

Post by paganel »

newnewpdro wrote: post #33

My childhood cat was declawed on the front paws, and I've had multiple cats since then, all with claws intact. It's definitely a significant difference in the cat's existence to be clawless. I'm happy to see this attitude shifting, but as others have commented here, there will almost certainly be more cats returned to shelters (and killed) when they won't stop shredding the furniture and carpet. Even if you trim thei…

An owner who gives his/her cat to a shelter because of some scratched piece of furniture doesn’t deserve to be a cat owner after all. What he/she would have done had his/her kids destroy said furniture? Turn them in to an orphanage?

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#56

Post by mdf »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #40

Do we have evidence that declawing causes lasting pain or psychological damage to the cat? I admittedly have no idea how’d you’d test this in an animal—but it seems like it should be a prerequisite to banning the procedure.

Shouldn't the burden of proof be on the opposite side? To allow such procedure, it should be proven that there are no adverse effects.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#57

Post by raverbashing »

alexmlamb wrote: post #52

It's not exactly a quick fix, but how many generations would it take to breed cats with substantially softer claws? This could be an interesting program perhaps for the government to undertake. I also wonder if crispr or embryo selection could be used if a GWAS could find genes that lead to softer claws. The selection techniques have been used to improve milk yields for cows, so it seems like making cats which don't…

NO cat needs to be declawed (no more than any human needs to have their fingertips cut off).

Have a scratcher and trim off their nails, problem solved.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#59

Post by bredren »

purpleidea wrote: post #16

Not a cat owner, so actually curious: I have a friend cat who always scratches me, which is quite painful and leaves marks. Is there a way to trim the nails so this doesn't happen, or is the only solution to avoid the cat?

There are cat nail clippers designed for this purpose. Done right the cat does not notice and you must do it or they will scratch you.

Re: Cat Declawing Is Banned by New York State Lawmakers

#60

Post by raverbashing »

vageli wrote: post #50
taeric wrote: post #48

I'm actually somewhat torn on this one. At face value, I fully agree. More, none of my cats have been declawed, as I just don't see the point. That said, I also don't buy the mutilation argument at face value. We literally castrated all of our male cats, and nobody bats an eye. Indeed, you seem to be frowned upon if you don't. Surely that is as mutilating to a male cat as losing a knuckle?

> I'm actually somewhat torn on this one. At face value, I fully agree. More, none of my cats have been declawed, as I just don't see the point. > That said, I also don't buy the mutilation argument at face value. We literally castrated all of our male cats, and nobody bats an eye. Indeed, you seem to be frowned upon if you don't. Surely that is as mutilating to a male cat as losing a knuckle? At least castration has…

Castration, as opposed to just a vasectomy, helps with behavioural issues as well. And it's not just "making the cat tamer", but male cats get in fights with other cats more often if not castrated.
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