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Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

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Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#151

Post by mirimir »

scarface74 wrote: post #136
mirimir wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. But would they have done this without the recent publicity about third-party app tracking? I suppose that they must have been working on this for some time. And maybe they deserve some slack. But there should at least be an apology for not acknowledging tracking by third-party apps. For years. While they were touting their privacy stance. And it's not just about behavioral ads. Some repressive governments have…

How do you “guarantee” third party apps don’t do tracking and allow them - with your permission - to know your location?

I'm not arguing that it's easy. Or even possible.

What I am arguing is that Apple has been BSing people.

> What happens on your iPhone, stays on your iPhone.

Because that's just not true. Unless, I suppose, you don't install any third-party apps on your phone. So then, that privacy claim should look like:

> What happens on your iPhone, stays on your iPhone.#

> # Unless you install third-party apps.

Otherwise, dissidents will feel safe using iPhones. Until they're dead or in prison.

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#152

Post by criley2 »

propertymagnate wrote: post #93
rapsey wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thriving as in their own miniscule segment destined to remain marginal. Definitely not apple target market.

I'm not arguing that, I'm responding to this part of your comment, by showing products the privacy obsessed segment are presumably happy with as they are paying for: "Trying to sell something to privacy obsessed tech segment is a futile effort. They are never happy and don’t want to pay for anything anyway."

I think you're both right. He's saying that from the perspective of the largest private business in the world with $100B+ yearly revenues, derping about on services worth a few million in revenue is just noise. Apple isn't going to shift it's business to capture a $10M/yr market or whatever it is.

And you're off here being like "BUT THEY DO EXIST (even if they are so trivially small that they wouldn't even make a rounded-up single line on Apple's financial disclosures)".

From Apple and his perspective, these tiny businesses are irrelevant.

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#153

Post by dunnevens »

new299 wrote: post #133
braythwayt wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a dichotomy, so I will just say that in addition to circumventing the app store’s take, developers have users to “blame” for the race-to-the-bottom of the surveillance capitalism bucket. As long as users will balk at paying even 4.99 for an app, developers will make them free and then engage in dark business models like surveillance and terrible in-app purchases. To be fair and stop “blaming the victims,” th…

The problem is that app developers often just do both. They charge, but still use adverts. You see this in games in particular. Paying removes /most/ adverts. However it does not remove the “watch an advert to get an extra life” style adverts. I assume it also does not remove any ad tracking.

I can't speak to all games, but the pay-once games I've seen have been free of this. No advertising at all, beyond the little ads for their DLC (if they have any.)

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#154

Post by [deleted] »

scarface74 wrote: post #127
banachtarski wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know when I'll believe it? When the un-screw up their app store which vastly incentivizes the development of free-to-use ad-driven apps that prey on user tracking data over premium alternatives. Ad-based revenue has a higher value proposition to developers because it dodges the inane anachronistic 30% tax. "Privacy" first is an utter illusion when the majority of apps approved in this closed ecosystem that ostens…

Developers aren’t doing ad supported apps because of the 30% “tax”. Did software sell with ads when they had to pay physical retail stores 60% for distribution? They do ads because people are too cheap to buy apps.

[deleted]

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#155

Post by Talyen42 »

IMTDb wrote: post #53
threeseed wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can release a free app and sell subscriptions through real world means e.g. advertising, PR. You control the customers and you pay Apple nothing. So this idea that Apple is forcing developers to do anything is nonsense.

We are a B2B SAAS company offering analytics and marketing data. We wanted to offer our customer the ability to have a free app to interact with our service on their phone. We wanted our customers to subscribe on the web but not using in-app subscriptions. We are unable to release this app on the AppStore until we change our whole payment/subscription/billing stack to support Apple subscription system and agree to gi…

This is not true. Using apple's in-app billing system is optional. You can always keep your billing entirely out of your free app.

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#156

Post by goodmachine »

rapsey wrote: post #30
nafizh wrote: post #22

Lots of negativity/skepticism here which is reasonable I would say given tech companies' abuse of our trust. I for one, am happy that Apple can afford to offer privacy as one of its strong suites. Whether they can do it because of their business model or not is moot IMO. Everyone is here to make money, I would rather have someone who doesn't have to sell every aspect of my life to do it.

Trying to sell something to privacy obsessed tech segment is a futile effort. They are never happy and don’t want to pay for anything anyway. But that is not their target market anyway. It is the general public and these comments are just noise.

Last time I checked, 25% of the internet used a VPN at least once a month.

We can argue (somebody here will) as to the actual level of privacy conferred, but the segment is far from miniscule:

https://thebestvpn.com/vpn-usage-statistics/

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#157

Post by village-idiot »

rapsey wrote: post #30
nafizh wrote: post #22

Lots of negativity/skepticism here which is reasonable I would say given tech companies' abuse of our trust. I for one, am happy that Apple can afford to offer privacy as one of its strong suites. Whether they can do it because of their business model or not is moot IMO. Everyone is here to make money, I would rather have someone who doesn't have to sell every aspect of my life to do it.

Trying to sell something to privacy obsessed tech segment is a futile effort. They are never happy and don’t want to pay for anything anyway. But that is not their target market anyway. It is the general public and these comments are just noise.

I’d say Apple is doing just fine when it comes to convincing people to pay.

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#158

Post by WA »

jannes wrote: post #115
WA wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can refund purchases for up to 14 days. I consider this a somewhat well-kept secret, because nobody seems to make use of this.

How do you make use of this? It does not seem to be an obvious part of the app store.

It is indeed not very obvious:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204088

I heard you even get to keep stuff you wanted to get a refund for. But I haven’t tried this.

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#159

Post by faitswulff »

goodmachine wrote: post #156
rapsey wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trying to sell something to privacy obsessed tech segment is a futile effort. They are never happy and don’t want to pay for anything anyway. But that is not their target market anyway. It is the general public and these comments are just noise.

Last time I checked, 25% of the internet used a VPN at least once a month. We can argue (somebody here will) as to the actual level of privacy conferred, but the segment is far from miniscule: https://thebestvpn.com/vpn-usage-statistics/

I'm very skeptical that 25% of internet consumers use a VPN. I'd be more easily convinced that 25% of internet traffic is via VPN, but even that seems far fetched. I'm also extremely skeptical that you'd find accurate results on a random site's smattering of website resources.

Re: Apple is now a privacy-as-a-service company

#160

Post by gbear605 »

jclardy wrote: post #145
braythwayt wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a dichotomy, so I will just say that in addition to circumventing the app store’s take, developers have users to “blame” for the race-to-the-bottom of the surveillance capitalism bucket. As long as users will balk at paying even 4.99 for an app, developers will make them free and then engage in dark business models like surveillance and terrible in-app purchases. To be fair and stop “blaming the victims,” th…

The solution I believe still lies in Apple's court. Say you have an app that is a niche app with a 7 day free trial and a one-time purchase. How does this look to the user? Exactly like every other freemium/ad riddled/subscription/pay-to-play app. The download button says "Get" and underneath it you see "In-App Purchases Available." User expectations are destroyed at the download page. One part of the solution is to…

The app store already works like this. They clearly mark subscription apps like this, including free trials.
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