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Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

citylab.com

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Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#161

Post by kryogen1c »

btrettel wrote: post #103
pagnol wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes This is something I’m struggling with right now. The city where I live has a lot of mediocre or downright dangerous lanes for cyclists which are often very narrow and next to a column of parked cars so that riders can get hit by a suddenly opened door. When I then ride on the road instead, I often have to contend with car drivers who seem se…

Yes, those are often called "punishment passes". I've even had drivers pass me dangerously closely when I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone with sharrows printed in the lane. I stop and speak with some of these drivers at the stop light, so I'm not even breaking the law and they literally save zero time. Far too many of these drivers seem surprised that the speed limit is 15 mph as they seem to think they should dri…

> I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone

Where in the world is there a 15mph zone where cars can drive 40 that bikes want to go? I cant think of a single 15 mph zone in any of the 6 cities ive lived

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#162

Post by lrajlich »

chrisco255 wrote: post #50
ben7799 wrote: post #40

As a long time long distance cyclist an awfully lot of these lanes, both protected and painted/"sharrow" are really frightening. There is an anti-car/pro-bike lane group of researchers who want to push this style of road design super hard right now at all costs. There are still major problems with their designs though, they are working from the assumption cyclists won't learn to follow the rules of the road. Tell me…

Can't you just take the crosswalk to make a left?

in strictly legal sense you can if you dismount... There are other options (aka "box turn")

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#163

Post by btrettel »

kryogen1c wrote: post #161
btrettel wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, those are often called "punishment passes". I've even had drivers pass me dangerously closely when I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone with sharrows printed in the lane. I stop and speak with some of these drivers at the stop light, so I'm not even breaking the law and they literally save zero time. Far too many of these drivers seem surprised that the speed limit is 15 mph as they seem to think they should dri…

> I was riding 17 mph in a 15 mph zone Where in the world is there a 15mph zone where cars can drive 40 that bikes want to go? I cant think of a single 15 mph zone in any of the 6 cities ive lived

San Jacinto Blvd. at the University of Texas at Austin campus. I would intentionally ride there on my commute because the speed limit is so low.

To be fair, few drivers seem to actually go 40 mph, though 25-30 mph seems to be regularly observed, particularly on the downhill road next to it (Deloss Dodds Way). I could easily do 30 mph going downhill there. I think the speed limit is 15 in that entire area due to the heavy pedestrian traffic.

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#164

Post by mpwoz »

toast0 wrote: post #80
framebit wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a bike commuter who's not exactly in Tour de France riding condition, I whole-heartedly love what few physically protected bike lanes there are in my city. They've greatly extended the range of places I feel comfortable riding my bike. I don't know if I'll ever be in good enough shape to feel comfortable claiming a lane and riding in traffic anywhere but neighborhoods and steep downhills. Yeah, it's a pain to turn…

If I have to get off the bike at most of my intersections and turns, I might as well take a bus, because I'll get there faster. It might make seem to be reasonable to have these protected lanes for slower? cyclists in addition to allowing vehicular cycling, but there are two problems with this: a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes; b) it discourages cyclists from joining the flow…

Assuming a city grid, wouldn't you have at most 2 turns to get where you're going (assuming start and end inside the grid)?

Inside a city these dedicated bike lanes are great, especially with dedicated bike traffic lights. Obviously doesn't apply to longer/winding rides.

I'm in Seattle and we have one here (2nd Avenue) that "feels" a lot safer than cycling alongside parked cars/traffic.

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#165

Post by lrajlich »

pagnol wrote: post #97
toast0 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I have to get off the bike at most of my intersections and turns, I might as well take a bus, because I'll get there faster. It might make seem to be reasonable to have these protected lanes for slower? cyclists in addition to allowing vehicular cycling, but there are two problems with this: a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes; b) it discourages cyclists from joining the flow…

> a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes This is something I’m struggling with right now. The city where I live has a lot of mediocre or downright dangerous lanes for cyclists which are often very narrow and next to a column of parked cars so that riders can get hit by a suddenly opened door. When I then ride on the road instead, I often have to contend with car drivers who seem se…

this is a thing, happened to me today in fact on a neighborhood street.

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#166

Post by my_username_is_ »

WhompingWindows wrote: post #3

I ride extensively around the Providence, RI area. Cars are simply a scourge to biking here, at a time when we need less global and local pollution and we need to improve health via air quality and exercise. We have VERY few protected lanes, mostly there are "sharrows" aka faded pictures of bikes on the road that do absolutely zilch. I am routinely honked at and ignorant/rude people yell things out of their car windo…

As a former Rhode Islander, I firmly believe that the East Bay Bike Path is the single greatest piece of infrastructure in the state.

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#168

Post by hannasanarion »

u801e wrote: post #159
hannasanarion wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why there need to be bike lines, either between the parking lane and the sidewalk, so that it's protected from traveling cars, or on the left side of the travel lane so they're more visible and less likely to get doored.

> Which is why there need to be bike lines, either between the parking lane and the sidewalk, The problem with this is when an intersection comes up, cars preparing to turn or approaching from an intersecting road cannot see the cyclist in time to avoid colliding with them.

This can be avoided with good intersection design that gives bicycles their own light cycle or puts the bike lane's stop line ahead of the automotive stop line.

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#169

Post by Xamayon »

btrettel wrote: post #95
ben7799 wrote: post #40

As a long time long distance cyclist an awfully lot of these lanes, both protected and painted/"sharrow" are really frightening. There is an anti-car/pro-bike lane group of researchers who want to push this style of road design super hard right now at all costs. There are still major problems with their designs though, they are working from the assumption cyclists won't learn to follow the rules of the road. Tell me…

> There is an anti-car/pro-bike lane group of researchers who want to push this style of road design super hard right now at all costs. I agree with this, at least for activists as I don't have much experience with researchers. Many people view bike lanes as some sort of panacea, and they sometimes end up making the situation worse than it would be otherwise for the exact reasons you mention. Just to give an example,…

Ack, making the bike lanes protected in this case could easily make things worse. Additional barriers right up to the on/off ramps might reduce visibility of bikes approaching the crossing. Worst case, at night or during less than ideal weather, even attentive drivers might not have enough warning to stop safely. Good luck at the meeting, hopefully it's not too late to get them working on an actual solution...

Re: Roads with protected bike lanes make both cycling and driving safer: study

#170

Post by toast0 »

mpwoz wrote: post #164
toast0 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I have to get off the bike at most of my intersections and turns, I might as well take a bus, because I'll get there faster. It might make seem to be reasonable to have these protected lanes for slower? cyclists in addition to allowing vehicular cycling, but there are two problems with this: a) it encourages car drivers to assume bicycles should not be in the lanes; b) it discourages cyclists from joining the flow…

Assuming a city grid, wouldn't you have at most 2 turns to get where you're going (assuming start and end inside the grid)? Inside a city these dedicated bike lanes are great, especially with dedicated bike traffic lights. Obviously doesn't apply to longer/winding rides. I'm in Seattle and we have one here (2nd Avenue) that "feels" a lot safer than cycling alongside parked cars/traffic.

I commute through Seattle from the ferry dock to south lake union. I could technically do it in two turns, but that wouldn't be great in terms of avoiding hills, avoiding streets with heavy traffic (i rode on denny during commute once, not going to happen again), and avoiding the damn trolley rails (also, not going to touch westlake where the trolley is again either).

I don't choose to ride on 2nd ave, because it's too different for the one or two blocks I could be on it, and the transitions are hard. It's a much better idea than some of the other protected lanes I see on my route though. I can't imagine it's worth it for me to go up and down Marion to use it though. (Western is a much nicer slope)

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