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Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

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Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#11

Post by GavinMcG »

SomeOldThrow wrote: post #7
tptacek wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would they use fish? Fish is nice and all, but zsh is a much more mainstream shell.

Since when is mainstream better? Why did they choose zsh? They don't justify that either. It's just odd to pick one post-bash shell but not the other when they have very similar feature sets—autocomplete, persistent global variables, attention to end-user quality. EDIT: apparently zsh doesn't have persistent or global variables, my bad.

Mainstream is often better in terms of unofficial support/learning resources, and by definition better in terms of familiarity/market share. For something like a shell, forcing a niche choice needs justification when it's not clearly better than the alternatives.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#12

Post by SomeOldThrow »

GavinMcG wrote: post #11
SomeOldThrow wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since when is mainstream better? Why did they choose zsh? They don't justify that either. It's just odd to pick one post-bash shell but not the other when they have very similar feature sets—autocomplete, persistent global variables, attention to end-user quality. EDIT: apparently zsh doesn't have persistent or global variables, my bad.

Mainstream is often better in terms of unofficial support/learning resources, and by definition better in terms of familiarity/market share. For something like a shell, forcing a niche choice needs justification when it's not clearly better than the alternatives.

Fish is clearly better than the alternatives.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#14

Post by bangonkeyboard »

tptacek wrote: post #4
SomeOldThrow wrote: post #2

I'm really surprised they went with zsh rather than fish. I guess they want to preserve the ability for existing `source` scripts to work.

Why would they use fish? Fish is nice and all, but zsh is a much more mainstream shell.

fish was written by an Apple engineer.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#15

Post by latexr »

SomeOldThrow wrote: post #7
tptacek wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would they use fish? Fish is nice and all, but zsh is a much more mainstream shell.

Since when is mainstream better? Why did they choose zsh? They don't justify that either. It's just odd to pick one post-bash shell but not the other when they have very similar feature sets—autocomplete, persistent global variables, attention to end-user quality. EDIT: apparently zsh doesn't have persistent or global variables, my bad.

Most Terminal users might not even notice the shell changed from Bash to ZSH. Those same users would notice it, had they changed it to Fish.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#16

Post by SomeOldThrow »

latexr wrote: post #15
SomeOldThrow wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since when is mainstream better? Why did they choose zsh? They don't justify that either. It's just odd to pick one post-bash shell but not the other when they have very similar feature sets—autocomplete, persistent global variables, attention to end-user quality. EDIT: apparently zsh doesn't have persistent or global variables, my bad.

Most Terminal users might not even notice the shell changed from Bash to ZSH. Those same users would notice it, had they changed it to Fish.

> Most Terminal users might not even notice the shell changed from Bash to ZSH.

If that's an argument in favor of ZSH, I think I've missed the point.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#18

Post by eropple »

SomeOldThrow wrote: post #8
nhooyr wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really annoying to have to learn new language when zsh is so similar to bash.

It's really annoying to learn bash, so I don't see how that works in zsh's favor.

To be honest I'm hesitant to respond to you because of the level of spittle-flecking you're doing in this thread but I would guess that, by virtue of bash being the standard Mac shell and zsh being a close-enough-but-better replacement, the necessary learning has already happened and overwhelmingly more Mac terminal users will be at least functional with it immediately.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#19

Post by latexr »

SomeOldThrow wrote: post #16
latexr wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most Terminal users might not even notice the shell changed from Bash to ZSH. Those same users would notice it, had they changed it to Fish.

> Most Terminal users might not even notice the shell changed from Bash to ZSH. If that's an argument in favor of ZSH, I think I've missed the point.

It’s an argument in favour of ZSH over Fish. It will cause less disruption, while providing better features than the current default.

Re: Use zsh as the default shell on your Mac

#20

Post by maximente »

SomeOldThrow wrote: post #2

I'm really surprised they went with zsh rather than fish. I guess they want to preserve the ability for existing `source` scripts to work.

as far as i know !! does not work on fish, which means it's dead in the water (had to) as far as i'm concerned.
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