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Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

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Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#11

Post by tptacek »

albertcardona wrote: post #10
tptacek wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Economies win arms races. The Cold War ended because we outspent the Soviets. The DRM arms race will work the same way; it's over when one side makes it prohibitively expensive for the other to keep up. If you look at the amount of effort it took to break the last X360 iteration, or the fact that there's still no public break of Apple FairPlay, you can see where this is going. If it costs $500,000 to break BD+ v1, an…

You are underestimating the power of an ocean of determined people with nothing better to do.

I think you're massively overrating the latent pool of reversing and software protection talent, and I backed my argument up with examples. There aren't 1,000 DVD Jon's out there.

[late] Let me reword that: if you can break BD+, you do have something better to do, and you can charge 250-350/hr to do it.

Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#13

Post by [deleted] »

albertcardona wrote: post #10
tptacek wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Economies win arms races. The Cold War ended because we outspent the Soviets. The DRM arms race will work the same way; it's over when one side makes it prohibitively expensive for the other to keep up. If you look at the amount of effort it took to break the last X360 iteration, or the fact that there's still no public break of Apple FairPlay, you can see where this is going. If it costs $500,000 to break BD+ v1, an…

You are underestimating the power of an ocean of determined people with nothing better to do.

[deleted]

Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#14

Post by albertcardona »

tptacek wrote: post #11
albertcardona wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are underestimating the power of an ocean of determined people with nothing better to do.

I think you're massively overrating the latent pool of reversing and software protection talent, and I backed my argument up with examples. There aren't 1,000 DVD Jon's out there. [late] Let me reword that: if you can break BD+, you do have something better to do, and you can charge 250-350/hr to do it.

What you say makes a lot of sense. And yet I know people who would break the code as a matter of principle, feel good, and not charge anyone for it.

Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#15

Post by tptacek »

albertcardona wrote: post #14
tptacek wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're massively overrating the latent pool of reversing and software protection talent, and I backed my argument up with examples. There aren't 1,000 DVD Jon's out there. [late] Let me reword that: if you can break BD+, you do have something better to do, and you can charge 250-350/hr to do it.

What you say makes a lot of sense. And yet I know people who would break the code as a matter of principle, feel good, and not charge anyone for it.

Name two of them, and then tell me why they haven't done it yet.

Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#16

Post by demallien »

mattmaroon wrote: post #12

I don't really have much specific knowledge on encryption, but I've heard over and over that this or that DRM method was "the one", and time after time they've fallen. It's enough to make me skeptical.

I do DRM for a day job, including cracking systems to find their vulnerabilities (and then patch those vulnerabilities, before the pirtes exploit them - fun!). TPM is not the same as the other solutions, it really is a bitch to crack. You're pretty much reduced to reverse enginering the entire CPU, removing the TPM module, and then fabbing your own unprotected copy of the CPU. As you can probably imagine, this is not within the reach of a couple of bored uni students.

Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#17

Post by deathbyzen »

tptacek wrote: post #11
albertcardona wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are underestimating the power of an ocean of determined people with nothing better to do.

I think you're massively overrating the latent pool of reversing and software protection talent, and I backed my argument up with examples. There aren't 1,000 DVD Jon's out there. [late] Let me reword that: if you can break BD+, you do have something better to do, and you can charge 250-350/hr to do it.

Of course there aren't 1,000 DVD Jon's out. You only need one :)

Re: Atari Founder Proclaims the End of Gaming Piracy

#18

Post by albertcardona »

tptacek wrote: post #15
albertcardona wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you say makes a lot of sense. And yet I know people who would break the code as a matter of principle, feel good, and not charge anyone for it.

Name two of them, and then tell me why they haven't done it yet.

I can do so over a beer, not here. Find me (it's an invitation.)
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