Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

techcrunch.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 233 posts

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#31

Post by MichaelApproved »

darkpuma wrote: post #21
weka wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It should be opt-in but ... hey. It's something.

May as well forbid it outright at that point. (They should. Everybody deserves protection from this, even the people who don't understand the threat it poses. The uninformed, ignorant or naive all deserve protection, since preying on ignorance or naivety is generally considered abhorrent by anybody who's not totally morally defective.)

> May as well forbid it outright at that point.

I was wondering about that point myself. I am thinking that they may not have the authority to create such law, so they still allow ISPs the ability to track but make it as restrictive as possible.

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#32

Post by yeukhon »

asark wrote: post #18
rhino369 wrote: post #5

Why not ban browser companies, operating system companies, computer/phone companies, email providers, etc. too?

We should ban collecting tons if info about people, for all companies, period. We won't, because banks and CC companies are very into doing that and the politicians love them, but we should.

No. Because many businesses rely on data available. FAANG would be out of business then.

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#33

Post by ocdtrekkie »

rhino369 wrote: post #5

Why not ban browser companies, operating system companies, computer/phone companies, email providers, etc. too?

This is exactly it. The reason tech companies are so big on supporting regulations against ISPs is because those rules are narrowly carved out to not apply to them, eliminating a large chunk of their competition.

Imagine if this law also applied to Google and Facebook, and they couldn't charge more when you opt out of their data collection?

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#34

Post by zerocrates »

oldjokes wrote: post #25
mrguyorama wrote: post #11

I couldn't find links to the actual bill anywhere so I tracked it down: http://legislature.maine.gov/LawMakerWeb/summary.asp?ID=2800... The summary: "This bill prohibits a provider of broadband Internet access service from using, disclosing, selling or permitting access to customer personal information unless the customer expressly consents to that use, disclosure, sale or access. The bill provides other exceptions u…

I wonder what "use" means here. Is it now illegal for them to log your traffic at all? I think that would be the ideal way to phrase the law, you can't even write to a logfile/dbms much less do anything with that data unless the user opts in.

> The bill provides other exceptions under which a provider may use, disclose, sell or permit access to customer personal information.

There's probably a "as necessary to provide the service" exception more than large enough to encompass internal logging.

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#35

Post by malloreon »

I look forward to the day when selling user's data requires the user's opt-in every single time a third party wants to access that data. No more "yes to all" or allowing blanket usage in TOS/EULAs.

People who use apps that sell their data should be bombarded with requests to use that data each and every single time, until they either decide the app isn't worth it or the app decides they should try a different business model.

And ad targeting should be included in that. Add a new notifications button to FB - companies that have requested advertising access to me. If I decline or don't answer, I never see their ads.

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#36

Post by ryanisnan »

malloreon wrote: post #35

I look forward to the day when selling user's data requires the user's opt-in every single time a third party wants to access that data. No more "yes to all" or allowing blanket usage in TOS/EULAs. People who use apps that sell their data should be bombarded with requests to use that data each and every single time, until they either decide the app isn't worth it or the app decides they should try a different busines…

Each and every time? As a user who understands and consents to that request, that would be incredibly annoying.

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#37

Post by orblivion »

math_and_stuff wrote: post #15
ethanpil wrote: post #7

For all practical purposes it won't make a difference. When you sign up for ISP service there will be a new small paragraph buried deep in the long 10000+ word contract text that says you consent to them selling your browsing data, which you have to sign to start the service, which nobody reads anyway.

The bill explicitly prevents that behavior. "The 'opt-in' nature...would set it apart from other state internet privacy laws... the proposed Maine law also would prohibit any [ISP] from making the sale of customer data part of its mandatory [TOS]. It also could not charge higher fees to customers who refuse to opt in" https://www.pressherald.com/2019/05/29/maine-on-track-to-pas...

They can't charge more for refusing to opt in, so nobody will opt in. The only alternative seems to be a hike in rates for everybody. Which isn't necessarily bad, it's arguably better that people actually know what cost they're paying. It's just naive to assume that this is ISPs getting some "extra money" on the side. This is factored into the revenue from the service. Now they'll have to adjust their models.

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#39

Post by darkpuma »

MichaelApproved wrote: post #31
darkpuma wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

May as well forbid it outright at that point. (They should. Everybody deserves protection from this, even the people who don't understand the threat it poses. The uninformed, ignorant or naive all deserve protection, since preying on ignorance or naivety is generally considered abhorrent by anybody who's not totally morally defective.)

> May as well forbid it outright at that point. I was wondering about that point myself. I am thinking that they may not have the authority to create such law, so they still allow ISPs the ability to track but make it as restrictive as possible.

Could be. Where might such a restriction be coming from though? I don't think it would run afoul of interstate commerce stuff. Is there something in their state constitution that interferes with it?

Alternatively maybe they didn't have the votes necessary for a more potent law. Maybe some of the politicians were scared of doing anything too dramatic maybe?

Re: Maine passes bill to prevent ISPs from selling browsing data without consent

#40

Post by inetknght »

ryanisnan wrote: post #36
malloreon wrote: post #35

I look forward to the day when selling user's data requires the user's opt-in every single time a third party wants to access that data. No more "yes to all" or allowing blanket usage in TOS/EULAs. People who use apps that sell their data should be bombarded with requests to use that data each and every single time, until they either decide the app isn't worth it or the app decides they should try a different busines…

Each and every time? As a user who understands and consents to that request, that would be incredibly annoying.

Your consent should be considered an outlier and should not be used to hinder my lack thereof.
Post reply on HN