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Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

privacyinternational.org

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Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#171

Post by dwighttk »

abtom wrote: post #50
Alterlife wrote: post #39

This article focuses on the problems that truecaller poses for 'non-users". As a non-user of truecaller in India myself, I find myself in the minority. It seems I get none of the benefits (improved spam filtering, the chance to see who is calling me), and in the 'prisoners dilemma' sense, it appears I would loose nothing by installing it, because they already have my contact information. However, this is only half th…

If you're a non-user and do not wish your information to appear on the app, you can unlist your number here - https://www.truecaller.com/unlisting Though I do not agree with the method where as a non-user I need to manually opt-out of the service, it does seem to work. My number is no longer visible on the app.

The "Unlist Phone Number" button never becomes useable for me on that page, even after completing the google captcha

edit: Make sure you put a "+" in front of your country code

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#172

Post by fuzz4lyfe »

enitihas wrote: post #103
abtom wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're a non-user and do not wish your information to appear on the app, you can unlist your number here - https://www.truecaller.com/unlisting Though I do not agree with the method where as a non-user I need to manually opt-out of the service, it does seem to work. My number is no longer visible on the app.

I tried using the unlisting UI, but it says I need to install the app and deactivate my account before unlisting. When I install the app, it refuses to run unless I grant it all sorts of permissions. So it seems before unlisting, I need to give truecaller my data. This absolutely ridiculous.

Same here. Another dark pattern is they require the country code, they could have inferred it from my IP and auto populated it or had a list of countries via a dropdown instead they bury that the country code is required in a paragraph and disable the button if the phone number lacks it. At very least enable the button and pop up a error message if the country code is lacking. How many non technical users will give up with this form? I suspect many of them.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#173

Post by lotu »

kkarakk wrote: post #66
grive wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlisting does not mean that the info is removed. If they have full access on anyone having installed the app, it means they also have mined the conversations with your contacts. So they might not advertise what they know anymore, but the privacy concern remains anyway.

Yes but atleast you're not visible to others edit: so in order to use this, you have to install the app - "deactivate it" and only then will it accept the unlisting. Fucking bs

BS but I imagine this is how they verify you own the number and prevent a rival app from executing a denial of services attack on them by unlisting everyone’s number.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#174

Post by tty2300 »

oytis wrote: post #138
tty2300 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New technology has opened up new possibilities far beyond what your word of mouth example has. Megacorps are sucking up data on a mass scale and using it for evil such as manipulating elections, tricking you in to buying stuff and reporting your every action to the government. For this reason we need to think beyond the old ways of dealing with data.

Yes, the reality has changed. We have to either adapt our notions of privacy etc. to the new reality or pretend that nothing really changed. The latter seems to work, but one day you go to Africa (or India, or China, or just have to deal with someone who can ignore/circumvent the regulation), and - surprise! - the reality is still there.

Could say the same about anything. Should we ignore the reality that people like to steal things and make it illegal even though some still will?

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#175

Post by zeveb »

CaptainZapp wrote: post #101
DarkWiiPlayer wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDPR is 100% necessary and fundamentally a good idea. It has a lot of problems that just show how incompetent politicians can get on a bad day, but that doesn't invalidate the core idea.

It has a lot of problems that just show how incompetent politicians can get on a bad day Mind elaborating on them? The only potential issue, which I see, is some ambigiouty. However, I don't see how you could craft a legal frame work without some ambiguity, which needs to be resolved by the courts at one point. Unless your business model is dreck, I really don't see any issues with the GDPR as such.

> Mind elaborating on them?

My own biggest problem with the GDPR — other than the regulatory burden, which disproportionately imposes costs on small challengers and effectively protects large pre-existing firms — is the so-called 'right to be forgotten,' which is really a privilege to force others to rewrite history. Among other things, it effectively mandates mutable logs, which is horribly insecure (logs should be in principle even if not in fact immutable), and at a higher level it grants malefactors the ability to legally compel others to refrain from true speech about them.

Other than that, most of the GDPR is pretty good.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#176

Post by Kaiyou »

vanderZwan wrote: post #107
Kaiyou wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem I see is that politicians don't seem to have any good days.

You are living in a complex, mostly functioning nation state where the majority of conflicts is resolved in a civil manner. Not in a small tribal society where you might be murdered by someone physically stronger than you simply because he lusts after your partner. That simple fact proves how hyperbolic and naive your statement is.

..and how have politicians of the last, let's say 20 years, positively contributed to this? If the last good day was over two decades ago, I'm not sure how you're going to sell me this as a good thing.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#177

Post by thekyle »

zucker42 wrote: post #20
duxup wrote: post #2

This is one of my concerns ever since the first app asked for my contacts. You could be a mountain man and value your privacy.... but if you just know someone who uses tech you are exposed in any number of ways. In the US things like third-party doctrine have not aged well in the information age as just communicating with people can expose you in ways you can't ever control.

This is why I don't use WhatsApp despite the fact I know many people who use it. To use the app, you have to give access to your entire contacts list. Even if I'm okay with them having my information, I don't feel comfortable consenting for those in my contacts list who don't use WhatsApp.

I use WhatsApp without giving it access to my contacts list to chat with one friend who refuses to use anything else. On Android you just have to deny the contacts permission and everything else works fine.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#178

Post by mherdeg »

wycy wrote: post #160
mherdeg wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got a free loaner phone once a few years back ("Samsung Ultimate Test Drive") which came with pre-activated mobile phone service and was very clearly re-using a phone number that someone else had quite recently actively been using. While it was weird to get SMSes about SoCal drug deals, the strangest thing of all with that phone was opening the Lyft app and being automatically signed in to someone else's Lyft accou…

Is this because Samsung simply sent you a phone that hadn't been wiped and was still signed into all these accounts, or was it really just auto-signed in due to phone number? I did the Samsung Ultimate Test Drive as well and don't recall being auto-signed into anything (though I also got many SMSes and calls intended for the previous owner).

Well, when I got the device, the Lyft app was not installed. I visited the Play store, installed the Lyft app and ran it, and then: the Lyft app immediately signed me in, told me that my full name was Britney G-------, showed me "my" full e-mail address, and offered to let me book rides on her behalf, paying with her linked Visa card. It wasn't even clear how to switch accounts; it was like they were using the phone # as a primary key.

I sent Samsung some feedback about this but don't think the issue was on their side per se.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#179

Post by sterwill »

neilalexander wrote: post #162
Piskvorrr wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A shell company, operating out of Vanuatu, with VoIP servers in Vietnam and Venezuela? Gl;hf.

At some point those VoIP servers connect to PSTN. Someone is responsible for that.

The non-spammy network operators that interconnect to the spammy network operators make money through that interconnection. If you want them to disconnect their spammy customers, you have to convince them that it's worth it to lose them. This is a manual process and takes time.

Re: Betrayed by an app she had never heard of

#180

Post by jclardy »

sk0g wrote: post #43
baroffoos wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would be nice if mobile OSs had a permission that let apps save photos but to read photos it has to make an api request which opens the system photo picker and when you select a photo the app gets given access to only the photo you selected.

I think Android does/ can do just that? There's a native photo picking intent, and the app just gets back a photo. Whether it was from the camera, the gallery, etc, who cares? In practice, most apps would rather have their own in-app photo grid. Nothing to do with wanting to violate your privacy, I'm sure :)

iOS does as well. An app can use the system photo picker to allow the user to select a single/multiple photos without having "Photos" permission.

The problem is that granting full save permission also grants read permission, it would be more ideal if those were split.

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