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Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

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11–20 of 216 posts

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#11
post #5

> The same will eventually be said of Docker. I’ve yet to hear a single benefit attributed to Docker that isn’t also true of other VMs, I bought a Raspberry Pi and using a few commands, installed pre-configured Docker ARM images for 8-9 different media applications that would've taken me days to setup and manage individually. I didn't have to worry about dependencies or compilations. It just worked.

The problem of installing prepackaged applications was solved decades before Docker was a thing.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#12
I don't understand how these are comparable. Hadoop solved a hard problem that nobody had. Docker solves a simple problem that everyone has. It would make sense if you're talking about kubernetes and using it to build hundreds of microservices because it's currently in fashion. Whether you're using Docker, Packer, Ansible or whatever doesn't matter. They are all a solution to the same problem and saying one is better basically boils down to saying which brand of hammer is better.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#13
post #11
post #5

> The same will eventually be said of Docker. I’ve yet to hear a single benefit attributed to Docker that isn’t also true of other VMs, I bought a Raspberry Pi and using a few commands, installed pre-configured Docker ARM images for 8-9 different media applications that would've taken me days to setup and manage individually. I didn't have to worry about dependencies or compilations. It just worked.

The problem of installing prepackaged applications was solved decades before Docker was a thing.

even considering puppet etc things weren't this simple, the base image depends on the provider so you'd get variants depending on the kernel and glibc version, especially with openvz based host

now, on bare metal server and premium providers where you're able to specify the boot image that wouldn't have been a problem, but there are lot more people dealing with cheap housing giving you whatever image they baked last than people doing bare metal deployments and for the former docker is an order of magnitude easier to deploy

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#14
Isn't this the way it normally works though, a bunch of investments don't work out - those are wasted - those that do work out, the people who did the investing get more money back.

Or to put it another way: There must have been some few Hadoop investments that worked out, the same will eventually be true of Docker.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#15
post #3

I have come across quite a few articles that mention that for 99% of 'big' data problems, Hadoop and the like are an overkill. Simple tools, with a beefy machine is just as sufficient for the task. Is that the reality of today? Personally I too feel that distributed computing is an overkill for most 'big' data problems.

Yes it's still true. Now with stream processing frameworks and infinite cloud storage, you can have a single big machine churn through TBs of data easily.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#16
post #5

> The same will eventually be said of Docker. I’ve yet to hear a single benefit attributed to Docker that isn’t also true of other VMs, I bought a Raspberry Pi and using a few commands, installed pre-configured Docker ARM images for 8-9 different media applications that would've taken me days to setup and manage individually. I didn't have to worry about dependencies or compilations. It just worked.

Properly packaged Debian/raspbian apps are still an “apt install” away. Your use case, which is common, tells me that packaging / distributing may need some love, not that there’s a fundamental difference.

And the convenience does not come free - a random docker is almost as bad as a random executable.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#17
post #7
post #3

I have come across quite a few articles that mention that for 99% of 'big' data problems, Hadoop and the like are an overkill. Simple tools, with a beefy machine is just as sufficient for the task. Is that the reality of today? Personally I too feel that distributed computing is an overkill for most 'big' data problems.

It really depends on how "big" your data is. If you have data that is actually big (= doesn't fit onto a machine), then Hadoop is a reasonable candidate. Otherwise you are fine with a lot simpler tools. This has probably been true for quite some time, and companies are just slowly realizing now that their relevant data isn't actually that big. On the other hand computing power and storage has still grown in the last…

About 5 years ago I worked at a small, business oriented telco. The biggest ETL was processing external CDRs, applying call tariffs, and creating bills and reports. A previous developer had been adamant about using a Hadoop cluster to process this, storing all of it in Cassandra NoSQL.

The idea was interesting, but it didn't quite work out. At some point he left the company and we had to do something about the pipeline, as it was crashing most of the time. We did some calculations, and figured that with the right approach, a good old MySQL+PHP solution would do the trick. And it did.

Having switched jobs myself in the meantime, I'm happy knowing the system is still running, and finding people to maintain it is relatively easy.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#18
post #2

> ...but standard VMs allow the use of standard operating systems that solved all the hard problems decades ago, whereas Docker is struggling to solve those problems today. What are these supposed "hard problems" the author speaks of?

Sandboxed, consistent environments to run code in?

Although with recent adventures in speculative execution, that sandboxing isn't quite as 'solved' a problem as previously thought

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#19
post #16
post #5

> The same will eventually be said of Docker. I’ve yet to hear a single benefit attributed to Docker that isn’t also true of other VMs, I bought a Raspberry Pi and using a few commands, installed pre-configured Docker ARM images for 8-9 different media applications that would've taken me days to setup and manage individually. I didn't have to worry about dependencies or compilations. It just worked.

Properly packaged Debian/raspbian apps are still an “apt install” away. Your use case, which is common, tells me that packaging / distributing may need some love, not that there’s a fundamental difference. And the convenience does not come free - a random docker is almost as bad as a random executable.

>> Properly packaged >> packaging / distributing may need some love

I am yet to see a single project which is relatively new and is packaged on Debian (let alone Raspbian). And lets be honest - nobody is genuinely using Raspberry Pi to run an outdated media server.

Re: Billions wasted on Hadoop startups, the same will eventually be true of Docker

#20
Yup. Tech faabionabilism is akin to Big4/MBB FUD flavor of the quarter... populism/marketing doesn't a necessity make. Docker, Kubernetes, gulp, Hadoop, mosh, Nix, SmartOS, serverless, cloud, virtualization, [insert tech fashion hype > utility here].

Speaking of Hadoop: my vehicle is parked outside one of the HQ's of another top 10 Hadoop startup. It's one of the most expensive, nearly empty buildings in the highest rent areas of the Valley. (Money flushing sound here.)

Fun fact: one of the enterprise Hadoop CTOs is a broney.

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