Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then you notice it's dark outside... ;)
And then see that a solar eclipse was predicted for today.
At 9AM!
Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
81–90 of 181 posts
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#82> Captioning his find, Burrows said that the fantasy writer had “accurately predicted how the internet would propagate and legitimise fake news” It's like when you have one clock, you know what time it is. When you have two clocks they're always somewhat different, and so you're no longer certain of the time, and have less faith in clocks. Fake news has always been with us and the internet just propagates it along wi…
Fake news has always been with us and the internet just propagates it along with everything else. I wonder what's easier: Curbing the dissemination of fake news on the web or understanding the allure of & preventing people from wanting to believe fake news in the first place. I honestly think it is the former, so I think there is value in combating it from that angle (in addition to others).
The problem with the second approach is that it plays heavily into psychology, confirmation bias and such. What if people don't want to consume fake news but are instead incapable of recognizing or admitting that it is fake? Even in the face of facts and reality?
There are psychological pathologies which display similar behavior - narcissism being one of those where reality is conveniently rejected in favor of what works for you.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#83If you read the interview, Bill Gates rightly predicted the rise of sophisticated networks of trust, content raters and algorithms that would tell you what is worth reading and what isn't. It's no one's fault that no one listens to those recommendations--it's just human nature to be predisposed to confirmation bias. But Pratchett's claim--that all information would have the same veneer of authority on equal terms--is…
> sophisticated networks of trust, content raters and algorithms that would tell you what is worth reading
Didn't this happen? Some versions more formalized by others but isn't this what people mean by an individual's bubble? The concern being that these bubbles can be so different as to be incompatible with others.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#84Fake news has always existed. The only difference between today and hundreds of years ago is who had the most reach. Back in the past only the church and royalty had the power to spread (fake) news. Nowadays anyone can go on social media and do the same.
> Back in the past only the church and royalty had the power to spread (fake) news.
How so? Do you have an example in mind?
I can think of a lot of fake news or misleading propaganda deliberately disseminated by seditious and revolutionary groups during the French and American revolutions.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
I do not underestimate the level that Pratchett's comedy can operate at. It took me maybe 15 years for the penny to drop between first reading 'Unseen University' and connecting it to the Invisible College of Robert Boyle - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_College May I note that being brilliant does not stop someone from being a children's comedy novelist. If people are annoyed by this, perhaps they should th…
That description seems more appropriate for, say, Roald Dahl than it does for Pratchett. Pratchett was, for the most part, a comedy fantasy author. Most of his writing was appropriate for younger audiences (with exceptions, like Monstrous Regiment), but I wouldn’t call it children’s books. The fact that his Tiffany Aching books are specifically aimed at the Young Adult market suggests that he agreed.
Interesting comparison. Roald Dahl has in his oeuvre many stories that are far less intended for children than anything I have ever read by Pratchett. Pratchett keeps pretty much all of his stories accessable by at least teenagers. You cannot say the same for Dahl.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#86Fake news is a pendulum. Now we have it, we start to know what it is, we start to understand how it's created and distributed. Things can start swinging the other way. But this takes time.
If you really wanted to end fake news and had unlimited time and money, a great way to do it would be to publish as much completely fake news as possible, so that people figure out that they need to use reputable, trusted sources, or end up a fool. Out of money, out of time, and that what they believed after learning about it on a Facebook group or reddit was wrong. People learn from painful experiences the most, unfortunately. So some people have learned from Trump getting elected. Others haven't learned, some probably won't. It's very easy to be fooled.
If you think of fake news like a virus, then publishing more fake news acts kind of like an anti-virus. Distributing a version of the problem that is easier for the immune system to detect and combat and won't kill anyone - to inoculate against the real thing.
Bill Gates is right. He's just early.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#87If you read the interview, Bill Gates rightly predicted the rise of sophisticated networks of trust, content raters and algorithms that would tell you what is worth reading and what isn't. It's no one's fault that no one listens to those recommendations--it's just human nature to be predisposed to confirmation bias. But Pratchett's claim--that all information would have the same veneer of authority on equal terms--is…
> It's no one's fault that no one listens to those recommendations
People do, in fact, listen to the recommendations.
Those gatekeepers, however, are just as heavily biased as the “news sources”, which themselves are actually just gatekeepers for freelance writers and press release mills.
Whatever point in the network is influential is, obviously, the highest value target for corruption, and more layers of gatekeepers with no greater inherent resistance to corruption don't change anything.
> But Pratchett's claim--that all information would have the same veneer of authority on equal terms--is patently false today.
No, it's not.
> Everyone knows how to filter for content they should believe and content they shouldn't.
Yeah, everyone knows how to select the gatekeepers that reinforce their preconceived biases.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Fake news has always been with us and the internet just propagates it along with everything else. Contrary to the claim that the internet legitimized it, it made us more aware of how common it is, delegitimizing all news sources in the way that multiple clocks delegitimize clocks. It's also that those in power would love it for their opinions to be the "authoritative" ones and only ones permitted to be heard. Same…
The narrative you're expressing, that the mainstream media as a complex exists to further propaganda on the part of the "elites" and that only the web has been able to provide an honest and unbiased form of news is undermining the actual subject at hand, which is the degree to which the web and those unwashed masses are being employed as tools for propaganda by the same elites. The implicit (and arguable unjustified)…
> The narrative you're expressing, that the mainstream media as a complex exists to further propaganda on the part of the "elites" and that only the web has been able to provide an honest and unbiased form of news is undermining the actual subject at hand, which is the degree to which the web and those unwashed masses are being employed as tools for propaganda by the same elites.
Being able to control the flow of information is much more powerful than being able to buy bots. When information was monopolized by a few outlets, those outlets had tremendous power and they did abuse it. Infamously, the New York Times denied the widespread famine in the USSR during the 30s and mass starvation of Ukrainians, now considered an act of genocide by many countries (most estimates ranging from 3-5 million Ukrainians starved). This sort of thing cannot happen in today's connected world. If millions of people are starving, YouTube video after YouTube video of dead people littering the streets would be posted to call out the deniers on their falsehood (provided the victims had internet access). But the 1930s was before the internet, and the world just had to take the word of reporters. The NYT author that denied the starvation won the Pulitzer prize for his false reporting.
> The implicit (and arguable unjustified) trust in the mainstream media has simply been replaced by an implicit (and equally unjustified) trust in alternative media, resulting in greater obfuscation, deeper manipulation and more lies, rather than more truth.
I don't think there's much basis for this claim. I think that the internet makes stupid people that believe in falsehoods much more prominent and and easier to find. Florida's reputation for being a crazy state is analogous to this. Florida police are required by law to publish all arrest reports, which makes crazy stories easy to find and publish. The internet essentially does that for the ignorant and stupid. I'm willing to bet that despite increased anxiety over people being led to falsehood, actual belief in falsehood is either the same or declining.
I think you're also misrepresenting the situation when you say that trust in mainstream media is being replaced by trust in alternative media. Do you earnest think that people trust the average YouTube video more than mainstream media outlets? I think that's an important factor at play here: much of the alternative media is well aware of the fact that can't rely on trust to get people to listen to believe them, and so they have to back up their claims with solid evidence if they want to be trusted. Those YouTube channels I consider reputable are very cautious about only making claims that they can back up with evidence.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#89> You will have authorities on the Net and because an article is contained in their index it will mean something.
Sad, but true. Gates was right: Facebook and other mediums propagate misinformation. By virtue of it appearing on FB, it does mean something, just not something necessarily beneficial.
Re: Terry Pratchett warns Bill Gates about fake news (1995)
#90Fake news has always existed. The only difference between today and hundreds of years ago is who had the most reach. Back in the past only the church and royalty had the power to spread (fake) news. Nowadays anyone can go on social media and do the same.
> Back in the past only the church and royalty had the power to spread (fake) news. How so? Do you have an example in mind? I can think of a lot of fake news or misleading propaganda deliberately disseminated by seditious and revolutionary groups during the French and American revolutions.
The church and royalty had power to arbitrarily execute those that spoke out against them. Inquisition against heretics is one example.