The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas • Hacker News Board

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#371

Post by spraak » Thu, May 30, 2019, 9:19 AM UTC

ekianjo wrote: post #289

spraak wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal of Mars to me is silly. Mars is already worse off in terms of climate than Earth. Why not work to improve what we have? The only appeal I see is "uncharted territory" / wild west

Going to the New World was also silly for Europeans at the time. Everything was going to be more dangerous, more risky and life threatening. But pushing ourselves to go beyond risk is what makes humans progress in the long run. Going to another planet is a huge, difficult step forward. By all means everyone who goes there will be worse off, but think beyond their existence, 300 years in the future. It may become a pr…

I think the analogy is poor, because the "New World" was abundant with resources. The new world of Mars is not, and nearly everything would need to be brought there.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#372

Post by spraak » Thu, May 30, 2019, 9:20 AM UTC

kpU8efre7r wrote: post #226

spraak wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal of Mars to me is silly. Mars is already worse off in terms of climate than Earth. Why not work to improve what we have? The only appeal I see is "uncharted territory" / wild west

Mars at its best is far less hospitable than the most inhospitable places on Earth. With that said- Earth is still only one planet and it would be wise for us to spread out for survival and resources.

Existentially I don't understand the need to perpetuate our species.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#373

Post by spraak » Thu, May 30, 2019, 9:22 AM UTC

inamberclad wrote: post #322

spraak wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal of Mars to me is silly. Mars is already worse off in terms of climate than Earth. Why not work to improve what we have? The only appeal I see is "uncharted territory" / wild west

Do you propose not going to space at all? Or is there somewhere better nearby? The Earth won't support us for much longer.

And yet somehow Mars will [support us]? To me this is like having a car in need of repair (Earth) and instead finding some abandoned junker (Mars) rusting in the forest and saying "yes, I need that one!"

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#374

Post by spraak » Thu, May 30, 2019, 9:24 AM UTC

epanchin wrote: post #203

spraak wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal of Mars to me is silly. Mars is already worse off in terms of climate than Earth. Why not work to improve what we have? The only appeal I see is "uncharted territory" / wild west

Ironic that you use the Wild West as an example. Do you think the world would be better now if the British had just worked on improving Britain rather than settling in America? I’m sure there were many people calling the settlers silly back then too.

I meant it as in "the freedom to do what one wants", not so much literally. And even so, Mars has probably less resources than even the (physical) Wild West did. In another comment I made the analogy that Earth is like a car in need of repair, and Mars is a rusting junker in the forest - in far worse of a state than Earth, but somehow there is the desire to go there.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#375

Post by ekianjo » Thu, May 30, 2019, 9:35 AM UTC

spraak wrote: post #371

ekianjo wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going to the New World was also silly for Europeans at the time. Everything was going to be more dangerous, more risky and life threatening. But pushing ourselves to go beyond risk is what makes humans progress in the long run. Going to another planet is a huge, difficult step forward. By all means everyone who goes there will be worse off, but think beyond their existence, 300 years in the future. It may become a pr…

I think the analogy is poor, because the "New World" was abundant with resources. The new world of Mars is not, and nearly everything would need to be brought there.

abundant with resources? How do you explain the first colonies starved to death in several different locations?

Its not the resources that matter as much as the ability and capability to extract something from them.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#376

Post by akvadrako » Thu, May 30, 2019, 10:36 AM UTC

fabioborellini wrote: post #27

Maybe Elon should visit Europe or Asia and check out an underground mass rapid transit system or two. They have two orders of magnitude larger capacity. And even their capacity is finite. And keep in mind that the NYC Subway and the London Underground are NOT a good example of a modern mass transit system.

I've read that Elon hates mass transit, which is why he's such a car enthusiast. So I don't think he'll be looking to existing solutions for inspiration.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#377

Post by vidarh » Thu, May 30, 2019, 10:38 AM UTC

jcranmer wrote: post #112

HillRat wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The price tag for the tunnel is pretty much what you’d expect at the low end of civil engineering costs, so there’s no room in the pricing if things start to go south. Musk’s entire premise is that there are magical inefficiencies in the commercial tunnel boring machines he’s purchased, and he assumes that spacecraft and automotive engineering expertise is sufficiently transferable to uncover those opportunities and…

Based on my ballpark guesses at the cost of the tunnel, I would be surprised if The Boring Company actually made any money on this. They're liable for all cost overruns, and they have to bear the costs of developing the custom Tesla car manufacturing and safety qualification themselves. The most galling part to me is that I can't see how they make the mandated 4400 people/hr limit. That requires 26 second headways be…

You're thinking in train terms. There's nowhere near 26 second headway between vehicles in busy tunnels near me - cars enter and exit the road from multiple sides before entering and the headway in the tunnel is much shorter. 30-45 second headway makes sense when your station stops blocks the entrance to the tunnel, which is the norm for rail systems, but not for car tunnels.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#378

Post by idlewords » Thu, May 30, 2019, 1:04 PM UTC

toephu2 wrote: post #361

idlewords wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What did exploring the Moon bring us?

CAT scanner, computer microchip, cordless tools, ear thermometer, insulation, satellite television, etc [1] [1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/space/5893387/Apoll...

Not sure about the ear thermometer or cordless tools, but I'm pretty certain we would have gotten the computer chip and satellite TV without sending a guy to the Moon.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#379

Post by idlewords » Thu, May 30, 2019, 1:06 PM UTC

edmundsauto wrote: post #278

idlewords wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, what's an innovation that came out of the moon program or the LHC that has broader social benefit?

Quite a few things, to name a few: * improved firefighting protective gear * Athletic shoes * Sports stadiums being able to move the field of play * seismological monitors for everything from trains to trucks * base defibrillator tech * cordless power tools * skin care: "Estee Lauder uses digital image analyzers and software based on NASA lunar research to evaluate cosmetic products." [0] https://www.nasa.gov/sites/d…

Putting a dude on the Moon seems like a roundabout way to get better skin cream and footwear.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#380

Post by bluGill » Thu, May 30, 2019, 1:10 PM UTC

r3bl wrote: post #218

bluGill wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every city I've ever seen has a large amount of personal cars on the road. Sure some people in some cities ride in shared public transit, but don't try to pretend that there are not large amounts of people that for whatever reason don't. You might want to look closer to home and solving your own problems instead of attacking the US.

> but don't try to pretend that there are not large amounts of people that for whatever reason don't. Oh, I know precisely the reason: there's no viable alternative in place. It might surprise you to learn that other countries were in that same situation and aren't anymore. When there's something more efficient, reliable, and cheaper to use, people tend to prefer that. But of course, you'd first have to step outside…

I have stepped outside of the US. I saw a lot of car traffic in Barcelona Spain. I saw a lot of car traffic in Frankfurt Germany even though I was only in the city for a few hours. My friends in Sweden got around by car for every trip when I visited them.