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Angular v8.0

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Re: Angular v8.0

#101

Post by meredydd »

mhd wrote: post #19
royjacobs wrote: post #3

Congratulations on the release! For all the talk of React and Vue I still like the 'batteries-included' approach of Angular. I mostly do Kotlin in my day job so Angular aligns fairly nicely with the way applications are structured. I don't get the militant need for terseness that's seen in approaches like React Hooks. I also don't need the choice between multiple backwards-incompatible (or competing) routers, nor do…

I've been burnt by the non-Euclidian enormity of ExtJS, so I understand the desire for something simpler. On the other hand, when you leave the world of progressive enhancement and widgets (ie. jQuery), you find yourself needing a lot of common infrastructure and picking and matching that can be quite tedious (never mind dependency hell), which is something that react always had issues with -- and that seems to exten…

> I really want to go back to late-90s desktop UI development sometimes…

While it's not a JS framework, can I interest you in an explicitly VB/Delphi-inspired app development tool for the web?

It's got drag'n'drop design, you code entirely in Python (including the front end - it transpiles to JS), and it even has a built-in database: https://anvil.works/

Re: Angular v8.0

#102

Post by rolltiide »

pure wrote: post #72

Angular is really a great framework. I think a lot of people complaining about Angular haven't actually built an app in Angular 4+. I also wish the Angular team had just called Angular 2 something else, since the 1 -> 2 transition frustrated a lot of people who jumped ship and never looked back. I also understand that people just have different preferences, which is fine, too. Out of the box, you get: routing with la…

How do you guys keep up with these frameworks?

You get stuck on one project or in one startup for 2 years and Angular has moved 6.5 whole number versions

all while the rest of the job market is confused but kind of tolerating why you jump around jobs so much

if I'm using Angular, my "side project" isn't going to be using a higher version of Angular every 6 months. Its going to be using React or something to see what I'm REALLY missing.

Re: Angular v8.0

#103

Post by pier25 »

christophilus wrote: post #73
pier25 wrote: post #69

While the effort by the Angular team deserves praise, I think for the vast majority of use cases it is a mistake to do it all client side. With some exceptions, there is really no benefit in making a SPA but there are many drawbacks. I don't say this lightly. I used AngularJS in 2015 and since then I've been making SPAs in React, Vue, and Inferno + Mobx.

I tend to agree. But in defense of the SPA, my experience is that over time, most screens accrete complexity. You start out with a simple content screen. Then the client wants comments. Then they want richer comments. Then they want live comments. Etc. Over time, most of my web applications tend to require richer and richer interactivity on each screen. As a result, it's nice to have started out with a client-side fr…

> As a result, it's nice to have started out with a client-side framework

You mean like Angular or Ember?

Because you can perfectly use Vue, React, Inferno, Svelte, Imba, etc, on a multiple-page application.

Re: Angular v8.0

#104

Post by pier25 »

switz wrote: post #96
pier25 wrote: post #69

While the effort by the Angular team deserves praise, I think for the vast majority of use cases it is a mistake to do it all client side. With some exceptions, there is really no benefit in making a SPA but there are many drawbacks. I don't say this lightly. I used AngularJS in 2015 and since then I've been making SPAs in React, Vue, and Inferno + Mobx.

I'm not a fan of Angular, but how many times are we going to have this conversation. At this point, this is a completely off-topic comment that has no place in this thread. I'm getting javascript fatigue fatigue. > With some exceptions, there is really no benefit This is just a contradictory sentence of hyperbole. Who cares if there are plenty of use-cases to not write a SPA. There are also plenty of use-cases for it…

> There are also plenty of use-cases for it, and many benefits.

I obviously disagree, but please elaborate.

Re: Angular v8.0

#105

Post by remify »

jmkni wrote: post #98
pier25 wrote: post #69

While the effort by the Angular team deserves praise, I think for the vast majority of use cases it is a mistake to do it all client side. With some exceptions, there is really no benefit in making a SPA but there are many drawbacks. I don't say this lightly. I used AngularJS in 2015 and since then I've been making SPAs in React, Vue, and Inferno + Mobx.

I'm kind of with you. I think SPA's can be suitable (sometimes) for internal line-of-business applications, where you have a degree of control over the environment the end user will be using your application on (ie the device/browser (+version)/etc) and bandwidth isn't a big issue. In this sort of environment, Angular can work pretty well. For public facing applications, where you can't say with confidence that your…

You can do severside rendering with Angular Universal.

Also Angular has helped me a lot with bowser compatiblity in the past (IE 9).

Re: Angular v8.0

#106

Post by bpye »

pure wrote: post #72

Angular is really a great framework. I think a lot of people complaining about Angular haven't actually built an app in Angular 4+. I also wish the Angular team had just called Angular 2 something else, since the 1 -> 2 transition frustrated a lot of people who jumped ship and never looked back. I also understand that people just have different preferences, which is fine, too. Out of the box, you get: routing with la…

I've been using Angular for a few months now and it's mostly been a good experience. We've been using Angular 7.

My biggest gripe, and this might just be my inexperience, is fighting the change detector to try and ensure reasonable performance when displaying a large number of elements. There are certainly mechanisms to do this but it does seem to take some work.

Re: Angular v8.0

#107

Post by imcotton »

romanovcode wrote: post #38
zihotki wrote: post #30

I wonder what's the story behind delays of Ivy? Can somebody elaborate? It was first scheduled for v6 (don't remember , then for v7, now there is v8 and it's again rescheduled for v9.

It needs to be backwards compatible and it is tested with google internal applications and needs to be approved by said applications.

That what they have been saying for years, not what the REAL reason.

Re: Angular v8.0

#108

Post by pure »

azangru wrote: post #99
pure wrote: post #72

Angular is really a great framework. I think a lot of people complaining about Angular haven't actually built an app in Angular 4+. I also wish the Angular team had just called Angular 2 something else, since the 1 -> 2 transition frustrated a lot of people who jumped ship and never looked back. I also understand that people just have different preferences, which is fine, too. Out of the box, you get: routing with la…

> It's also interesting to see the React community move towards some of the things that Angular has been doing for years: embracing TypeScript, extracting business logic to services (or you can call them Hooks), creating injectable shared state (or you can call it Context). Huh? Hooks are just a way to use component lifecycle in absence of classes (note how React is pushing towards having components as functions as o…

Definitely correct me if I'm wrong, but I also thought hooks were for factoring out common logic and sharing it among functional components. I see lots of "hooks" libraries floating around.

For Context, like you said, it existed before, but everyone was told not to use it. After the new API came out, people started suggesting ditching Redux for Context, and I know a lot of people did that. Using Context in that way is very similar to creating a stateful service in Angular and injecting it into your components.

Re: Angular v8.0

#109

Post by pier25 »

phponpcp wrote: post #81
pier25 wrote: post #69

While the effort by the Angular team deserves praise, I think for the vast majority of use cases it is a mistake to do it all client side. With some exceptions, there is really no benefit in making a SPA but there are many drawbacks. I don't say this lightly. I used AngularJS in 2015 and since then I've been making SPAs in React, Vue, and Inferno + Mobx.

It's all about the use case. If you're on an ecommerce website and click between category and PDP pages 5-10 times browsing, a SPA is going to make that transaction an order of magnitude faster. Since you're only loading the smallest possible payload (JSON) that contains only the things that have changed, it is optimized in a way that is never going to be achievable with server-side rendering. At least that's why I o…

Yes it's all about the use case, but I generally don't buy that argument.

First, because the largest ecommerce websites are not SPAs and are generating a shit ton of revenue. Not only Amazon and Ebay but also stuff like Magento and Shopify.

Second, while it can be argued that after a number of clicks the total kbs will be lower by using JSON and rendering on the client, the vast majority of users really care about the initial load. Much like monthly payments, it's generally better to have a consistent 500ms lag than a 3000ms lag on the initial load and then 200ms on every click. Of course I made these numbers to explain my point.

This does not apply to all use cases obviously. In some cases such as an application like Gmail an SPA is completely justified and my arguments do not hold, but in the case of e-commerce I think there are no valid arguments for an SPA.

Re: Angular v8.0

#110

Post by hesarenu »

stupidcar wrote: post #39
sheeshkebab wrote: post #6

Angular feels like frontend framework built by backend java Spring developers, that hate frontend development.

This feels like an argument made by somebody who has never built a serious project in either, and has instead formed an opinion based on quick glance at the respective syntaxes. To me, Angular is what HTML and the DOM would look like if they had been designed from the beginning for application development: - Custom elements backed by controller classes. - Data-binding and event-binding syntax baked into HTML - Compon…

React seems far more like a project created by people who dislike front-end development - that seems way off. For me react is the perfect fit for front-end development. You have syntax similar to html and logic in plain javascript. Angular is like some heavy java back end framework.
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