Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Angular v8.0

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 210 posts

Re: Angular v8.0

#11

Post by vfc1 »

royjacobs wrote: post #7
microcolonel wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Congratulations on the release! For all the talk of React and Vue I still like the 'batteries-included' approach of Angular. It's a different story when your application is huge and mostly made of batteries. ;- )

When a typical application spends multiple megabytes just for the webfonts and logo JPGs on the front page, I don't really care whether my application bundle is 200k or 500k, though. I care more about productivity. Now, this clearly needs SOME boundaries, but let's not start a whole "Electron" thread again :)

The bundle size is now much better, and will only get better with Ivy. Also, I don't think it makes the most important comparison point although it certainly is one to consider.

Most websites on the internet load several megabytes of Javascript.

For a full-size SPA, I think Angular is a great choice, but for incremental use cases like adding some interactivity to a mostly static page, it's still not the main use case, although that will change with Angular Elements.

Re: Angular v8.0

#12

Post by royjacobs »

vfc1 wrote: post #11
royjacobs wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When a typical application spends multiple megabytes just for the webfonts and logo JPGs on the front page, I don't really care whether my application bundle is 200k or 500k, though. I care more about productivity. Now, this clearly needs SOME boundaries, but let's not start a whole "Electron" thread again :)

The bundle size is now much better, and will only get better with Ivy. Also, I don't think it makes the most important comparison point although it certainly is one to consider. Most websites on the internet load several megabytes of Javascript. For a full-size SPA, I think Angular is a great choice, but for incremental use cases like adding some interactivity to a mostly static page, it's still not the main use case…

Yes, that is absolutely fair. I was indeed talking about Angular in the context of a full SPA, not a tiny component in a banner.

Re: Angular v8.0

#13

Post by rafaelvasco »

sheeshkebab wrote: post #6

Angular feels like frontend framework built by backend java Spring developers, that hate frontend development.

Front-end development is inherently chaotic right now, doesn't matter the framework. Things will get better.... I'm intrigued by Svelte.

Re: Angular v8.0

#14

Post by justanegg »

rafaelvasco wrote: post #13
sheeshkebab wrote: post #6

Angular feels like frontend framework built by backend java Spring developers, that hate frontend development.

Front-end development is inherently chaotic right now, doesn't matter the framework. Things will get better.... I'm intrigued by Svelte.

heard of vue?

Re: Angular v8.0

#15

Post by jmkni »

vfc1 wrote: post #11
royjacobs wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When a typical application spends multiple megabytes just for the webfonts and logo JPGs on the front page, I don't really care whether my application bundle is 200k or 500k, though. I care more about productivity. Now, this clearly needs SOME boundaries, but let's not start a whole "Electron" thread again :)

The bundle size is now much better, and will only get better with Ivy. Also, I don't think it makes the most important comparison point although it certainly is one to consider. Most websites on the internet load several megabytes of Javascript. For a full-size SPA, I think Angular is a great choice, but for incremental use cases like adding some interactivity to a mostly static page, it's still not the main use case…

For your second use-case (adding some interactivity to a mostly static page), Vue works really well.

For a full on SPA, Angular is lovely to work with.

Re: Angular v8.0

#16

Post by holografix »

I was recently at a Microsoft heavy tech conference and spoke to at least 50 .Net developers. Anyone who also did front end did so in Angular. I was surprised at how popular it is!

Re: Angular v8.0

#17

Post by p2t2p »

royjacobs wrote: post #8
sheeshkebab wrote: post #6

Angular feels like frontend framework built by backend java Spring developers, that hate frontend development.

Apart from being verbose, why is that a bad thing? Spring is used to successfully build massive applications. You can meme about Spring's AbstractFactoryBeans all day, but in the end it does what it's supposed to do.

Recently I had to hide a bunch of functionality for certain license type in a product. Spring + AspectJ turned it into a enjoyable experience - just add one annotation, two classes, one for aspect, another for exception mapper in rest and you can mark any class as "requires certain type of license" in one like of code now.

Re: Angular v8.0

#18

Post by benatkin »

rafaelvasco wrote: post #13
sheeshkebab wrote: post #6

Angular feels like frontend framework built by backend java Spring developers, that hate frontend development.

Front-end development is inherently chaotic right now, doesn't matter the framework. Things will get better.... I'm intrigued by Svelte.

Front-end development is really great right now, because of React, which makes it so you can develop in one language, but unlike past attempts like GWT [1], doesn't rely on leaky abstractions.

1: http://www.gwtproject.org/overview.html

Re: Angular v8.0

#19

Post by mhd »

royjacobs wrote: post #3

Congratulations on the release! For all the talk of React and Vue I still like the 'batteries-included' approach of Angular. I mostly do Kotlin in my day job so Angular aligns fairly nicely with the way applications are structured. I don't get the militant need for terseness that's seen in approaches like React Hooks. I also don't need the choice between multiple backwards-incompatible (or competing) routers, nor do…

I've been burnt by the non-Euclidian enormity of ExtJS, so I understand the desire for something simpler. On the other hand, when you leave the world of progressive enhancement and widgets (ie. jQuery), you find yourself needing a lot of common infrastructure and picking and matching that can be quite tedious (never mind dependency hell), which is something that react always had issues with -- and that seems to extend fractally, where it's not just MobX vs. React but then what framework/project setup you have on top of each of these choices. And now hooks.

Still, angular always struck me as going slightly too far into Java-land -- my Struts/J2EE/DI battle scars are larger than even my ExtJS mutilations.

And in between you've got VueJS/Vuex, which seems to move a bit too close to react at times, and EmberJs, which seems to move too slowly and/or without many people watching it.

I really want to go back to late-90s desktop UI development sometimes…

Re: Angular v8.0

#20

Post by arnvald »

royjacobs wrote: post #7
microcolonel wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Congratulations on the release! For all the talk of React and Vue I still like the 'batteries-included' approach of Angular. It's a different story when your application is huge and mostly made of batteries. ;- )

When a typical application spends multiple megabytes just for the webfonts and logo JPGs on the front page, I don't really care whether my application bundle is 200k or 500k, though. I care more about productivity. Now, this clearly needs SOME boundaries, but let's not start a whole "Electron" thread again :)

I think it's still worth paying attention to size of the JS download. If you download 500k of JS, it means that after ungzipping it, it will be 2mb or more. Your browser needs to parse and execute that code, which also takes time, and it impacts the user experience.

Also it's easier (at least from developer's perspective) to deal with a big image than to deal with big JS codebase. You can't just replace it with something smaller, you often need to spend a significant amount to shrink it.

Post reply on HN