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Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

vice.com

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Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#61

Post by Razengan »

sgift wrote: post #18
taneq wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, without some pretty strong new protections in place there is absolutely no upside and likely a significant downside to letting them in. The police are not your friends.

This post and the article have the same problem: Thinking the way police works/seems to work in the US (always out to get you) is universal to the world while it is the exception. Police in other countries usually works out of a desire to help.

> Police in other countries usually works out of a desire to help.

Maybe I've only seen the uglier parts of the world, but that statement is what seems to be the exception rather than the norm, and a dangerously naive assumption.

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#62

Post by jonathanstrange »

sgift wrote: post #18
taneq wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, without some pretty strong new protections in place there is absolutely no upside and likely a significant downside to letting them in. The police are not your friends.

This post and the article have the same problem: Thinking the way police works/seems to work in the US (always out to get you) is universal to the world while it is the exception. Police in other countries usually works out of a desire to help.

This is extraordinarily bad advice. If the police knocks on your door to talk to you about your behaviour (or business, or family), then you should definitely get a lawyer as soon as possible, no matter where you live.

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#63

Post by Razengan »

clouddrover wrote: post #39
sgift wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But in this scenario the police are unprompted at your door and their first ask is to come into your house. If the police just want to talk to you because they're concerned about you personally they'll just ask to talk to you in a place they wouldn't otherwise need a search warrant signed by a judge to enter. "Their first ask is to come into your house" is based on a quote Vice took out of context (and then blew up…

> I always wonder where people get this idea that the police (and law enforcement in general) are all crooks breaking/bending the law to get you Bitter experience. Never underestimate the dishonesty of a cop.

> Never underestimate the dishonesty of a cop.

Or rather, the lack of incentive for a person in a position of power, to not use that power for their own interests and at their whims.

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#64

Post by bmmayer1 »

mcv wrote: post #41
bmmayer1 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In many more countries outside the US, they are not.

True, and that should prompt any country to look around, compare results, and make decisions on what they want to be like. In my opinion, a police that's feared rather than trusted, is a sign of a police state or totalitarian regime. If that's not what the country wants to be, then it's a problem that needs to be fixed.

I think there's this assumption that countries are like sentient beings who can 'decide' things. The reality of how a society functions, from cultural norms to laws to violence, is a unique combination of the whims and desires and priorities of the population, for better or for worse...countries don't want things, people do.

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#65

Post by robdachshund »

sgift wrote: post #18
taneq wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, without some pretty strong new protections in place there is absolutely no upside and likely a significant downside to letting them in. The police are not your friends.

This post and the article have the same problem: Thinking the way police works/seems to work in the US (always out to get you) is universal to the world while it is the exception. Police in other countries usually works out of a desire to help.

I mean this is basically police harassing you for wrongthink. This is some 1984 stuff.

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#66

Post by [deleted] »

jammygit wrote: post #50

“Information about people believed to be “at risk” of becoming criminals or victims of harm is shared between civilian agencies and police and is added to the database when a person is being evaluated for a rapid intervention intended to lower their risk levels.” Remind anybody else of precrime from minority report?

[deleted]

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#68

Post by dTal »

munmaek wrote: post #58
sgift wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This post and the article have the same problem: Thinking the way police works/seems to work in the US (always out to get you) is universal to the world while it is the exception. Police in other countries usually works out of a desire to help.

This has absolutely nothing to do with the US and everything to do with an asymmetric relationship. The police have immense power, you do not. What do you have to gain from interacting with the police? Now, compare this to what you stand to lose by interacting with the police. The rule is simple: don't interact with the police. They are not your friends, anything you do or say can and will be used against you at a wh…

Ethics. If everyone avoided talking to the police all the time, it would make their job more difficult, and they would be less effective. Their job is important, and so I would prefer that people talk to the police and make life easier for them. Therefore, to be ethically consistent, I too should talk to the police.

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#69

Post by malms »

3pt14159 wrote: post #51

People here are overreacting. First, Vice is an unreliable news organization with seriously substantiated claims that one of its founders has backed white supremacists, including Proud Boys. It's also been involved in international drug smuggling. And inflating its advertising numbers by an order of magnitude. Second, the police in Canada are some of the finest in the world. There are problem spots that I've seen wit…

you are missing the truth and goal of such an article. people here think they are a counterpower to evil actors with their keyboards. The truth doesn't matter and you are going into the sense of enabling police instead of being acting as a counter power.

(just explaining the downvotes)

Re: Police in Canada Are Tracking People’s ‘Negative’ Behavior in a ‘Risk’ Database

#70

Post by laumars »

jammygit wrote: post #50

“Information about people believed to be “at risk” of becoming criminals or victims of harm is shared between civilian agencies and police and is added to the database when a person is being evaluated for a rapid intervention intended to lower their risk levels.” Remind anybody else of precrime from minority report?

First of all I want to say that I don't agree with the collection of this data.

...however there is an important distinction with Minority Report in that people were convicted of crimes based on premonitions. If this data was instead used to support at risk people - like how disruptive kids at school are often given support to help enable them to grow into better people - then I'd be more sympathetic with the motives. For example "at risk" people might be those from less affluent or educated backgrounds who might be resentful but they might just need a little help to realise they too have opportunities and potential.

The problem is, once you have this data, it becomes increasingly small steps from using it to enable those who need help the most to abusing it to persecute those who are already neglected by society.

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