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Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

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Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#41
post #19

> a bunch of contract clauses that basically lets the company own all IP while employed. This is default here as well (Germany), but I only interpret this as stuff done during work time. So the stuff I come up with and the code I write at the office on my workstation is automatically owned by my employee. That's fine, because if it wasn't, that would cause all kinds of legal trouble should I ever leave the company. B…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#42

Don't work on your project during the office hour, or allow your project to affect your performance at work. There are two main reasons: 1. The employer is paying you to help their product/service succeed. It is unprofessional and immoral to deceive them. I've seen some colleagues do this and I was disappointed in them. 2. Work you produce at your place of employment belongs to the employer. It depends on the contrac…

Also #1 leads to a situation where you don't put your 100% effort on either side, and you'll fail miserably on both your job and side project.

BUT I think while you're employed you should try to learn how budgeting, cashflow, capex/opex, taxes, accounting, etc. work.

This will be very helpful for the job you already have, and also for your side project and any future job.

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#43
post #24
post #19

> a bunch of contract clauses that basically lets the company own all IP while employed. This is default here as well (Germany), but I only interpret this as stuff done during work time. So the stuff I come up with and the code I write at the office on my workstation is automatically owned by my employee. That's fine, because if it wasn't, that would cause all kinds of legal trouble should I ever leave the company. B…

> But if I create things in my free time at home, on my own equipment, then that's MINE, and I might start a company from it That's not entirely accurate: You're required to submit it to your employer if it could be related to your work, see especially §18 (1-2) and §19 https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/arbnerfg/BJNR007560957.ht...

IANAL, but if I'm reading §2 correctly, that only applies to patentable inventions.

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#44
post #24
post #19

> a bunch of contract clauses that basically lets the company own all IP while employed. This is default here as well (Germany), but I only interpret this as stuff done during work time. So the stuff I come up with and the code I write at the office on my workstation is automatically owned by my employee. That's fine, because if it wasn't, that would cause all kinds of legal trouble should I ever leave the company. B…

> But if I create things in my free time at home, on my own equipment, then that's MINE, and I might start a company from it That's not entirely accurate: You're required to submit it to your employer if it could be related to your work, see especially §18 (1-2) and §19 https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/arbnerfg/BJNR007560957.ht...

Interesting. I was always afraid of creating stuff at home since I've started working in Germany. So. I can just create my own company, register domains and so on, and as long as it doesn't have anything to do with the company I currently work for, it is mine?

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#45
post #19

> a bunch of contract clauses that basically lets the company own all IP while employed. This is default here as well (Germany), but I only interpret this as stuff done during work time. So the stuff I come up with and the code I write at the office on my workstation is automatically owned by my employee. That's fine, because if it wasn't, that would cause all kinds of legal trouble should I ever leave the company. B…

This may sounds like a reasonable wording, but is very often not the case unfortunately. I believe it’s because you’re salaried rather than paid by the hour. Even though your contract is for a set number of hours, you’re expected to have just one job, and for that job to get your focus and attention in a way that you wouldn’t be expected to do if you were paid hourly. This means that companies often technically own t…

Related reading: https://medium.com/incerto/how-to-legally-own-another-person...

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#46

> participate in Pioneer.app tournaments so I can network Anybody has any experience with this. How did you got in? What was your experience with it?

I participated in Pioneer.app for several months, scoring near the top of the leaderboard each month, being selected as a Finalist a few times, but was not selected as a Pioneer. I wrote a long piece on my thoughts on this but haven't published it anywhere yet, so here's the TL;DR:

We found the tournament valuable, since we were able to receive feedback every week. The challenge of having to submit a progress update each week was also a great motivator.

We eventually stopped participating though, for a couple of reasons. Primarily, based on the time we were spending, and the returns we were getting, it wasn't worth it anymore. As we went on, the comments and feedback we received became less and less valuable, as other players continued to "game the system." I also had some serious concerns about lack of transparency with scoring, which made it hard to understand why we scored what we scored.

That said, a friend of mine was selected as a Pioneer and he says it's a good experience. I like the team and they've been responsive when I emailed them. I think the most important thing is to make sure that as you continue to participate, you make sure the tournament is continuing to provide value to you, like all things. It certainly was valuable to us at the beginning, but eventually lost its value as we grew.

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to reach out. You can contact me through Keybase, which is in my profile.

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#47

Do not do anything non-work related on company equipment! Ever, for any reason, seriously don't do it! Do not even research the idea! Assume the company is logging everything. They likely are. Honestly, I'd just focus on work and learn if you are just starting out. Learn as much as you can while employed by other folks (they are basically paying you to learn). Learn as much about the business your company is in too.…

I find that first advice a bit paranoid. What country are you from where it is normal that a company is logging and spying on its employers? I have a company laptop but there is no logging whatsoever. Outside office hours I use this laptop to do personal stuff all the time.

Quite a lot of larger companies use various endpoint monitoring / protection solutions that will log and stream back a lot of data in order to e.g. protect against device compromise and insider threats. It's not as though your manager is likely to have the ability to grep through your device history on a whim, but if you do get into a legal tussle they might be able to go back and review those for evidence.

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#48

Do not do anything non-work related on company equipment! Ever, for any reason, seriously don't do it! Do not even research the idea! Assume the company is logging everything. They likely are. Honestly, I'd just focus on work and learn if you are just starting out. Learn as much as you can while employed by other folks (they are basically paying you to learn). Learn as much about the business your company is in too.…

> Do not do anything non-work related on company equipment!

And ideally don't bring work equipment home (i.e. laptop). This could be used against you. Low probability but high impact for you.

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#49
There is one phrase that coders need to look for in the inevitable IP contracts employers ask for -- "related to the business that conducts".

It is reasonable for your employer to ask you not to compete with them. It is not reasonable for them to say not to do side projects. And that phrase, or something similar, is what makes the contract say that. I always ask for it to be put into employment contracts, and refuse jobs without it.

Re: Ask HN: How can I work towards building a company while employed?

#50
Show up. Do the work. Take every opportunity to learn the skills you deem relevant to your long term plans.

Don't fill up all your free time with other work-related projects. You won't be able to learn as fast on the job if you're constantly depleting your cognitive reserves.

Do sports. Go out. Read a book. Don't load up on side projects you might not be able to finish.

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