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The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

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Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#21

Post by enitihas »

alkonaut wrote: post #8
enitihas wrote: post #5

Yeah, and it also reveals what the world would look like if Windows phone won instead of android. Atleast for Android you have AOSP, which is atleast somewhat open source. If Windows phone and iOS were the only two alternatives, a ban on a phone company like huwaei would be a death sentence. Can't do much with windows or iOS.

The app ecosystem is a mess on AOSP. It feels like google just uses it to show a faux openness but there is no way that a non-enthusiast will get the experience they have in one of the 2 (formerly 3) major brand app stores. And that's really what this is about: app ecosystems. Making a good OS is easy, but getting mindshare/appshare is difficult (as microsoft learned the hard way). AOSP makes no difference I think. I…

Yeah, the entire Chinese android ecosystem is doing Okay with the official store. Would the same have been possible without Windows Phone? What would huwaei be able to do at all if they were selling Windows laptops. Android may not be linux but it is miles better than other mainstream mobile OSes.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#22

Post by baybal2 »

luckylion wrote: post #12
writepub wrote: post #4

Such iron, much grip. You can trivially install Google play store and services on 98% of the non-licensed phones in China. The fact that a $50B Chinese domestic Android market is thriving with zero control by Google proves the thesis to be untrue. Then there's Amazon's fire product line. The only reason it lags Google's play store is quality. If Amazon's hardware and software/store selection were 80% as good, they'd…

> You can trivially install Google play store and services on 98% of the non-licensed phones in China. You can. I can. My mother and 95% (99? 99.9?) of the android users cannot. > The fact that a $50B Chinese domestic Android market is thriving with zero control by Google proves the thesis to be untrue. In Western countries it's true. You also can't build an online business in Europe if you're blocked by Google becau…

Chinese phones come without Google apps in quite a number of countries other than China, and those are not only African countries. Last time I saw google free Xiaomi's in Malaysia and Indonesia for example

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#23

Post by enitihas »

fspeech wrote: post #10
alkonaut wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The app ecosystem is a mess on AOSP. It feels like google just uses it to show a faux openness but there is no way that a non-enthusiast will get the experience they have in one of the 2 (formerly 3) major brand app stores. And that's really what this is about: app ecosystems. Making a good OS is easy, but getting mindshare/appshare is difficult (as microsoft learned the hard way). AOSP makes no difference I think. I…

Europe could disallow preintalled app stores so everyone can install their own app store of choice.

Would they do the same for iOS too?

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#24

Post by pizza »

baybal2 wrote: post #19
Roritharr wrote: post #9

Google invested Billions into Android. Samsung tried to hedge for this by building Tizen(Bada) and realized how much needed to be invested to get an Android competitor going, so they kept the development going, but focused for their Smartwatches, as this would have to be a "if the worst happens" plan, not something that could be a profitable venture. LG has the Palm/HP borne WebOS for their TVs, i suspect with a simi…

> Google bought this platform with every dollar invested over more than a decade, they didn't do this only so that Apple had a competitor, but so that THEY had control over mobile eyeballs. Google's biggest trick was developers. They leveraged the decaying state of Java, and it being the default CS language in a lot of places. They simple showed a more attractive opportunity to tenths of thousands of Java devs stuck…

Makes me think whoever comes up with a mainstreamed way to do cross-platform mobile apps in Python will easily capture a large share of recent college grads, too, then.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#25

Post by petra »

fspeech wrote: post #10
alkonaut wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The app ecosystem is a mess on AOSP. It feels like google just uses it to show a faux openness but there is no way that a non-enthusiast will get the experience they have in one of the 2 (formerly 3) major brand app stores. And that's really what this is about: app ecosystems. Making a good OS is easy, but getting mindshare/appshare is difficult (as microsoft learned the hard way). AOSP makes no difference I think. I…

Europe could disallow preintalled app stores so everyone can install their own app store of choice.

And everybody will still install Play, Because many apps need Google Play Services.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#26

Post by fspeech »

luckylion wrote: post #12
writepub wrote: post #4

Such iron, much grip. You can trivially install Google play store and services on 98% of the non-licensed phones in China. The fact that a $50B Chinese domestic Android market is thriving with zero control by Google proves the thesis to be untrue. Then there's Amazon's fire product line. The only reason it lags Google's play store is quality. If Amazon's hardware and software/store selection were 80% as good, they'd…

> You can trivially install Google play store and services on 98% of the non-licensed phones in China. You can. I can. My mother and 95% (99? 99.9?) of the android users cannot. > The fact that a $50B Chinese domestic Android market is thriving with zero control by Google proves the thesis to be untrue. In Western countries it's true. You also can't build an online business in Europe if you're blocked by Google becau…

If Europe mandates no preinstalled app store every phone maker will make sure that the grandmas could install the store on their own.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#27

Post by pmlnr »

karmakaze wrote: post #18

We already know this, which is why we want a free platform based on AOSP and replacements for Google services.

... or just a Free platform that doesn't have a malware-able god process called zygote and all those insane layers of abstraction Android has.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#28

Post by fspeech »

petra wrote: post #25
fspeech wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Europe could disallow preintalled app stores so everyone can install their own app store of choice.

And everybody will still install Play, Because many apps need Google Play Services.

That would be fine since people will have the choice of the hardware they want.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#29

Post by luckylion »

_iyig wrote: post #14
fspeech wrote: post #7

It seems that it is up to Europe to give its people the choice in hardware and software by making appropriate regulations.

It’d be a better world if Europe could give people more choices by... giving them more choices, instead of regulating the choices that other countries provide and fundamentally control.

I'd really love to see that as well, but at the same time I have zero trust in our governments' ability to choose the right project/company/people to support/fund/subsidize.

I do hope they consider pushing alternatives, but also that it's a more organic process where "the market" has some say and not a move to give plenty of money to a university/company only to shut the project down after a few years of failure.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#30

Post by DEADBEEFC0FFEE »

fspeech wrote: post #15
NotPaidToPost wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is different from Korean manufacturers this time. This is China caught in a national security issue. - China has a huge domestic market and it may be sufficient in itself for a profitable venture - About half of Android phones are manufactured by Chinese brands. - China has deep pockets and are willing to play the long game. - They have no choice. Trump's used the nuclear option, which may well work in the short…

I think Google can compete on its own merit without having to be viewed as a monopolist, so I disagree that it won't be pretty for the US. Google will do fine on a more level playing field.

I think the post you replied to may not be referring to Google, but to all the other companies that will have a choice to build for a future Asian giant or US giant (Google). Knowing that they can be cut off by US Gov, may push investment east.
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