Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration • Hacker News Board

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#141

Post by wallace_f » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:08 AM UTC

Apocryphon wrote: post #95

wallace_f wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Japan is an extroardinarily unique place. Even Australia, NZ, the UK and America have not just lot in common when you compare them to Japan, but a surprisingly lot. Japan really does have its own culture and identity. The Japanese have always wanted to protect their culture, identity, and economy, going back to where n Perry shot off a cannon to get them to open up the West's plans. As a foreigner who loves Japan, I…

Again, it seems highly dubious that opening up to economic migration means the same set of policies used everywhere, and the same results everywhere.

I know you keep wanting to broadcast that opinion, but it is obviously not clear to be true. For reasons you can see in my comment, and also see this comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19988198

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#142

Post by Dylan16807 » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:09 AM UTC

9nGQluzmnq3M wrote: post #104

htfy96 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The points calculation table can be found here: https://www.juridique.jp/visa/hsp.php It seems that if you have a master's degree from top 300 universities, passed N2, aged under 30 and have high salary (10M yen+) you can easily get 100 points. Type 1 visa only requires 80 points and guarantees permanent residency in one year.

Note that "N2" is Level 2 of the Japanese Language Proficiency Test, which is the 2nd highest level of 5 and entails multiple years of study.

True, though for reference that's only 10 of the points. Hitting 10M yen is 40 and a master's is 20.

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#143

Post by Tor3 » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:19 AM UTC

hh3k0 wrote: post #111

Complexicate wrote: post #99

The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanese, but she was Miss Universe Japan 2015." Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japan…

> Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Just because she qualifies as Japanese from your point of view doesn't mean that the Japanese have to view it like you. White savior comple…

> but rather are the genetic conglomerate of their ancestors (which is hard to argue against) and thus links in a chain

But that's exactly it. It's not like that. Or shouldn't be. That's not what makes a person a part of a group (town, city, region, country, etc). It's a constraining, and wrong way of looking at things. It's something to grow out of. Heck, in my hometown we consider someone as 'from' this town (to translate the term we use, approximately) even if they're not born here, maybe they even moved here in their twenties, and maybe from another continent, maybe looking totally different; if they just 'fit in' and find their comfortable place here. If they bring on something new (combining culture/music from their background with something existing), even better. They are 100% part of what's us. Except for those of the never non-existent, but still tiny minority of the "you're not one of us" group. Those telling young girls (as did an old woman the other day, not in this town but out in the countryside) "you can't wear that traditional costume, you're not one of us" (the girl's grandfather was adopted from some place, or some such).

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#144

Post by atom-morgan » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:20 AM UTC

anthuman wrote: post #137

Complexicate wrote: post #99

The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanese, but she was Miss Universe Japan 2015." Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japan…

If you claim that she is all japanese, then aren't you denying her african-american roots? She is half japanese because half of her family and genetic history is from japan. The other half is from her african american father. Isn't it more bigoted to deny that half of her comes from her african american father? Also, there is a difference between ethnicity and nationality. She may be a full japanese national, but she…

> If you claim that she is all japanese, then aren't you denying her african-american roots?

I don't think so. I'm American, "all" American. I was born here and have lived almost my entire 29 years of life here. But I am also half-Korean.

I think it depends on whether OP meant Japanese as a citizen or Japanese as their sole ethnic background.

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#145

Post by [deleted] » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:30 AM UTC

hh3k0 wrote: post #111

Complexicate wrote: post #99

The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanese, but she was Miss Universe Japan 2015." Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japan…

> Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Just because she qualifies as Japanese from your point of view doesn't mean that the Japanese have to view it like you. White savior comple…

[deleted]

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#146

Post by zlakb » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:31 AM UTC

hh3k0 wrote: post #111

Complexicate wrote: post #99

The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanese, but she was Miss Universe Japan 2015." Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japan…

> Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Just because she qualifies as Japanese from your point of view doesn't mean that the Japanese have to view it like you. White savior comple…

If you said the same thing of a European country your comment would be flagged already.

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#147

Post by Tor3 » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:32 AM UTC

sridca wrote: post #135

Complexicate wrote: post #99

The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanese, but she was Miss Universe Japan 2015." Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japan…

> Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Isn't this true of other nations?

> Isn't this true of other nations?

Not as a general rule, no. What makes the distinction for me is the dialect they speak and their way of speaking. Then I'll have them firmly identified as 'from that town', or 'that particular part of the country' and there's no way for me to think of them differently. Where their parents came from has no part of it for me or for most people. It's just not possible for my mind to think of somebody who speaks like a native (as they will, when they were born here or moved here as a child) as being any kind of "outsider". In my experience small children never make any distinction either, anywhere in the world. That comes later, and they learn it from their parents. That's when the problems start.

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#148

Post by anthuman » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:32 AM UTC

atom-morgan wrote: post #144

anthuman wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you claim that she is all japanese, then aren't you denying her african-american roots? She is half japanese because half of her family and genetic history is from japan. The other half is from her african american father. Isn't it more bigoted to deny that half of her comes from her african american father? Also, there is a difference between ethnicity and nationality. She may be a full japanese national, but she…

> If you claim that she is all japanese, then aren't you denying her african-american roots? I don't think so. I'm American, "all" American. I was born here and have lived almost my entire 29 years of life here. But I am also half-Korean. I think it depends on whether OP meant Japanese as a citizen or Japanese as their sole ethnic background.

American is a nationality, it is not an ethnicity. There is no "ethnic american" due to historic reason.

You are half-korean, so what is your other half? White? So you are half korean and half white.

You wouldn't say you are 100% korean and 100% white. That would be ridiculous right? Your ethnic history and composition can't add up to 200%. Even if you claimed to be 100% korean or 100% white, neither white nor korean people would consider you to be 100% white or korean.

That's my point. There is nationality and ethnicity. Those are two different things. A chinese person could move to germany and become a german citizen or national. But nobody would consider him an ethnic german.

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#149

Post by philliphaydon » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:33 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #114

philliphaydon wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

14 years in this career and Japan is the only country I've had to do this with.

Have you changed timezone storage and displayed dates wrong (even if it was a configuration issue) in many other countries/customers?

All dates stored in UTC, so if any other country raised a ticket, we just told them to update their timezone in their profile, and the client was happy. Japan is the only country that this required incident reports.

Re: Japan Begins Experiment of Opening to Immigration

#150

Post by Tor3 » Thu, May 23, 2019, 11:35 AM UTC

griffinheart wrote: post #5

> Nor do Japanese cities have many official celebrations of immigrant culture or contributions. Tokyo certainly has. Almost every weekend right next to Yoyogi park[0] there is one, Cuban fest, Thai fest, Rainbow fest, Cambodia fest. And they are pretty big, with at least 10's of thousands of people visiting. 0 - https://www.yoyogikoen.info

Yep - and in the town I used to live in Japan there were yearly festivals showcasing various immigrant (or even visitor's) culture. All amateurs, just getting together to create something from their various home countries and doing a performance. And then a nice party afterwards, with everybody (audience and participants). And there are food festivals too.