Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 256 posts

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#131

Post by rchaud »

thkim wrote: post #49
yogthos wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is going to care about this in the long run, and it's pretty clear that China has already moved past US capabilities with tech like 5G. This will only spur more investment in domestic technology. China has a far better education system, a lot more people, and a government that's able to do long term planning. I expect them to leapfrog US within a decade or so.

I doubt it. Chinese system only works when they are playing catch up. There is no incentive for being a pioneer in a culture where IP is not protected. The system doesn't work when they need to push above everyone else.

> There is no incentive for being a pioneer in a culture where IP is not protected.

And yet mobile payments are integrated into Chinese e-commerce with the frictionlessness that Apple Pay and the others can only dream of.

Who defines what "pioneer" is? Is SV not "pioneering" because the vast majority of its companies are trying to be Salesforce and not Uber?

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#132

Post by Zenst »

theandrewbailey wrote: post #123
Zenst wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As they did with gunpowder, china-clay, silkworms, tea and even Panda's. I think only Panda's out of that small list have their IP still protected and the rest got industrial-theft treatment over the centuries. Though in fairness - they do share Panda's.

Pandas.

Yes, a loose connection but as China does treat them as if they are IP and with as much (if not more so) control - I include them. For example - if a country was to clone Panda's without China's consent, the level of outrage and response would be very comparable had some high-level IP had been stolen.

But as an isolated example - I'll agree it is a weak one, but worth including for how it is treated as IP by the country.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#133

Post by komali2 »

thkim wrote: post #85
simion314 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could pay researchers with money from taxes, then you will get more research into important problems and less into rich people concerns like baldness and beauty creams. Mathematicians,physicists also do a lot of research and they do not ask you to pay them to use their findings.

You seem to confuse between basic science and applied science. What you are saying is government should direct resources to every research. Basically saying that planned economy is better off than market economy. I wouldn't say market economy is a complete solution but time and again it has been proven to work better than planned economy. And also, why do you look down on applications? They are what actually make peo…

>What you are saying is government should direct resources to every research

Yea, this sounds like an awesome idea. Let's do it.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#134

Post by rchaud »

mschuster91 wrote: post #87
eleitl wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They're also clearly doing the exact thing they're accusing China of themselves here. Indeed, it's widely known that Cisco/Juniper is pretty much in bed with the US intelligence, and so is Microsoft. It is also not very smart to antagonize a world power that you also need for a lot of critical components, including lots of modern fabs.

> It is also not very smart to antagonize a world power that you also need for a lot of critical components, including lots of modern fabs. That requires the ability to think and plan long term, which many recent US presidencies have lacked.

The electoral cycle has shifted presidential incentives towards the short-termism that quarterly financial reports have for publicly traded companies. It's about looking good in the short term, by any means necessary.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#135

Post by hahahaha23 »

Zenst wrote: post #52
zaphar wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is one critical difference between America and China here. American companies have for the most part not been engaging in wholesale state sponsored theft of Chinese IP. Whatever you may think of the wisdom of a trade war, no one can really argue that China hasn't given the US all the ammunition it needed to give political cover to engaged in one.

Maybe, but then historically - did China start stealing western IP or did the west? Silkworms, tea, pottery, gunpowder.... many things that got invented in China and in effect stolen by the west. So you could argue that the west gave China ammunition in the past to go down this route. Either way - the whole aspect of one country stealing another's secrets in regard to trade and product has a very long history. What t…

China smuggled sweet potato

http://www.chinastudyabroad.org/indepthchina/1039-china-and-...

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#136

Post by Zenst »

sanxiyn wrote: post #63
Zenst wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but then historically - did China start stealing western IP or did the west? Silkworms, tea, pottery, gunpowder.... many things that got invented in China and in effect stolen by the west. So you could argue that the west gave China ammunition in the past to go down this route. Either way - the whole aspect of one country stealing another's secrets in regard to trade and product has a very long history. What t…

The west's stealing of silkworm (ca. 552) is a very interesting story. You can read about it here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smuggling_of_silkworm_eggs_int...

Yes and many a well-done documentary telling the story. Though the story of how tea was smuggled out is one I've only recently become aware of and equally as fascinating.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-great-british-tea...

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#137

Post by tssva »

yogthos wrote: post #4

This could be a really great thing in the long run. I'm really hoping this will promote open hardware and software in the future. Huawei is most likely to start relying on open source tech, since they're under so much scrutiny that's the best way to show they're being above board. Using open software and hardware would also show that same thing couldn't happen with their stack in the future. If they're smart, they'll…

> "US is basically terrified of losing control of mobile networks when 5G ends up being implemented by a Chinese company."

US companies don't control the mobile network device business now and won't after this. The largest beneficiaries of this are European.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#138

Post by sanxiyn »

desdiv wrote: post #128
shard wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vivante was a US company in name only (engineering in China) and after acquisition in China (by Verisilicon, whose founder and CEO is the brother of the founder and CEO of Vivante), it's not even a US company in name. Also, other US companies with GPUs besides the first 3 in your list are are open to licensing if the fees are big enough. I can't give more details than that though.

>Also, other US companies with GPUs besides the first 3 in your list are are open to licensing if the fees are big enough. This is a news story about a UK company being prohibited from dealing with Huawei due to its products containing "US origin technology". So I'm assuming that US GPU companies would also be prohibited from licensing to Huawei due to their IP's "US origin".

Note that Imagination Technologies (a company behind PowerVR) made an explicit statement that they are not affected by US ban because they have no US origin technology. Read Bloomberg report here:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-20/european-...

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#139

Post by dd36 »

alexeiz wrote: post #106
thommark wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think EU will trust Huawei at all. Recently my country Netherlands has found backdoors in Huawei equipments https://www.reuters.com/article/us-netherlands-huawei-tech/d... . and the biggest telecom in my country just banned huawei in its 5G network. I am sure this will prompt more countries to reject Huawei, especially if one of the bigger countries like Italy, France, or Spain rejects them.

I'm yet to see any concrete details of those "backdoors" they found in the Huawei equipment. I'm not saying there aren't any. But no concrete evidence of them surfaced yet. So far it's just some bullshit from the press that has zero knowledge of technology.

Why would they tell the public the backdoors they found? I wouldn’t even tell Huawei because then you’re telling them the ones you didn’t find. I’d just stop buying.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#140

Post by shuckles »

rchaud wrote: post #131
thkim wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt it. Chinese system only works when they are playing catch up. There is no incentive for being a pioneer in a culture where IP is not protected. The system doesn't work when they need to push above everyone else.

> There is no incentive for being a pioneer in a culture where IP is not protected. And yet mobile payments are integrated into Chinese e-commerce with the frictionlessness that Apple Pay and the others can only dream of. Who defines what "pioneer" is? Is SV not "pioneering" because the vast majority of its companies are trying to be Salesforce and not Uber?

Given the sorry technological state of mobile payments, such as their reliance on QR to authenticate, it’s more likely that quick adoption resulted from having no legacy POS solution and not superior innovation.

Unclear how QR has meaningfully less friction than NFC solutions.

Post reply on HN