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ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

bbc.com

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Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#91

Post by Symmetry »

dharma1 wrote: post #16

How long would it take Huawei (or a bunch of Chinese companies) to develop MIPS or RISC-V based phones? Too long to run out of cash (given that their sales for the foreseeable future just cratered) - or doable?

I'd guess on the order of 5 years. Taking silicon from idea to mass production is something that takes a long time and this isn't something that Huawei has done before.

EDIT: Apparently Huawei has been developing their own ARM cores via architectural liscence so they might be able to hack together a poor solution in less time than that by sticking with ARM in the short term and they might be able to get a decent MIPS SoC (for pre-existing Android compatibility) working in less time than 5 years.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#92

Post by z2 »

thkim wrote: post #49
yogthos wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is going to care about this in the long run, and it's pretty clear that China has already moved past US capabilities with tech like 5G. This will only spur more investment in domestic technology. China has a far better education system, a lot more people, and a government that's able to do long term planning. I expect them to leapfrog US within a decade or so.

I doubt it. Chinese system only works when they are playing catch up. There is no incentive for being a pioneer in a culture where IP is not protected. The system doesn't work when they need to push above everyone else.

In Korea, Japan, and many similar tech powerhouses, the link was two ways. With maturing technology and a desire to guard it, they developed better policy for protecting IP rights.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#93

Post by simonh »

smallstepforman wrote: post #13

ARM management are shooting themseves in the head here, this will divert Huawei funds to Risc-V instead. Time to dump ARM shares.

I'm afraid this theory fails the reality test. If it was that easy, and that certain Huawei would succeed and surpass ARM, they would have done it already and wouldn't need to be forced into it.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#94

Post by NotPaidToPost »

patentatt wrote: post #43
yogthos wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is going to care about this in the long run, and it's pretty clear that China has already moved past US capabilities with tech like 5G. This will only spur more investment in domestic technology. China has a far better education system, a lot more people, and a government that's able to do long term planning. I expect them to leapfrog US within a decade or so.

That overlooks the long history and cultural norm of borrowing or copying to advance. Chinese culture does not place the same value on pioneering as the US. If China does become a tech leader it will have to shift those deeply rooted cultural forces first. That, and their government that is capable of long term planning is also incapable of tolerating diversity, dissent, and free thought. I do not think China will be…

> Chinese culture does not place the same value on pioneering as the US.

That's clearly not true and is visible everywhere in China.

> is also incapable of tolerating diversity, dissent, and free thought.

That's not true.

Chinese culture tolerates diversity and uniqueness much more than Japanese culture, for example.

Discussions would gain in value if people commented on what they have at least a modicum of knowledge about and were open to learn others' cultures.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#96

Post by pi-rat »

kbumsik wrote: post #70
sanxiyn wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think so. Espressif is not Huawei.

But it's a Chinese SoC company. I'm wondering if the fight between US and China will widen to any SoC companies in the long term.

Probably not, you can only escalate this trade war so many times before it becomes unsustainable by one or both parties.

China will probably retaliate by banning a major US tech company, maybe Apple? Keep doing this a couple of times and pressure/lobbying/economic damage will force a resolution.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#97

Post by thommark »

yogthos wrote: post #4

This could be a really great thing in the long run. I'm really hoping this will promote open hardware and software in the future. Huawei is most likely to start relying on open source tech, since they're under so much scrutiny that's the best way to show they're being above board. Using open software and hardware would also show that same thing couldn't happen with their stack in the future. If they're smart, they'll…

I don't think EU will trust Huawei at all. Recently my country Netherlands has found backdoors in Huawei equipments https://www.reuters.com/article/us-netherlands-huawei-tech/d... . and the biggest telecom in my country just banned huawei in its 5G network. I am sure this will prompt more countries to reject Huawei, especially if one of the bigger countries like Italy, France, or Spain rejects them.

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#98

Post by xvilka »

Hopefully, it will not only boost RISC-V adoption, but also the FOSS EDA[1][2][3] tools, FPGA[4][5] and ASIC[6][7][8] design tools, various high-level languages, and toolkits to work with hardware designs. You can also follow my idea[9] and initiative to create low-level hardware IR instead of al tools parsing or producing Verilog/VHDL. Apparently, both are a pretty bad fit for chip design, thus many high-level languages[10] were created.

[1] KiCAD http://kicad-pcb.org/

[2] Qucs https://github.com/Qucs/qucs

[3] gEDA http://www.geda-project.org/

[4] Yosys https://github.com/YosysHQ/yosys

[5] SymbiFlow https://symbiflow.github.io

[6] The OpenROAD https://theopenroadproject.org

[7] The OpenROAD https://github.com/The-OpenROAD-Project

[8] Chisel3 https://github.com/freechipsproject/chisel3

[9] https://github.com/SymbiFlow/ideas/issues/19

[10] https://github.com/drom/awesome-hdl

Re: ARM memo tells staff to stop working with Huawei

#100

Post by yogthos »

thkim wrote: post #73
yogthos wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

somebody's been drinking propaganda Kool-Aid

which part is propaganda?

>There is no incentive for being a pioneer in a culture where IP is not protected.

This is demonstrably false https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGJ5cZnoodY

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