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Men, commit to mentor women

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Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#21

Post by inflatableDodo »

romanovcode wrote: post #6
timavr wrote: post #3

Only in America. Women is very dangerous, be aware. On serious note, somebody should do a startup which trains men to work with women. Apparently opportunity is huge. Should be the first slide. 60% of all men...

> which trains men to work with women. Immediately will be labeled as sexist and forced to close business. You can't win this battle, best way is to not play.

Are you kidding? There's loads of this kind of thing out there already. Just call it something sickening like 'Workplace Wellness' and you are good. Though I think they should borrow one of the existing programs from the US military if they want to get the message through to certain people I have encountered in management. Having a drill seargent bellow at them about it not being ok to molest their secretary might actually work wonders.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#22

Post by toxicFork »

> As for why this is happening, 36% of men say they’ve avoided mentoring or socializing with a woman because they were nervous about how it would look.

I am curious to hear all reasons.

Additionally, what are they proposing as a solution here? For men to say "I am comfortable to mentor women"? Ok, how do you get them to be at that place? Just saying "it's not acceptable to be uncomfortable" does nothing.

At my workplace you can submit to be a mentor and you get assigned people who would like to learn from your skills and experience. Sometimes these are men, sometimes these are women. You first commit to "be a mentor". Then it is your responsibility and duty to do your mentorship well no matter who is assigned to you. Sure you would get a right to vote against who your mentee is but most of the time the commitment motto is enough to face being uncomfortable.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#23

Post by SiempreViernes »

xupybd wrote: post #5

It’s a simple risk reward call. There is far more risk of accidentally crossing the line with the opposite sex. Yes MeToo has shed light on a lot and no doubt been a net positive but there will be a time until the dust settles and people learn how to work together safely. We no longer have a good formal set of norms for male female interaction. Maybe that could make some sense in situations like the work place where…

"No longer"? #MeToo was about highlighting how many dysfunctional behaviours occurred with the current set of norms, so clearly the old norms didn't work great either.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#24

Post by timavr »

inflatableDodo wrote: post #21
romanovcode wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> which trains men to work with women. Immediately will be labeled as sexist and forced to close business. You can't win this battle, best way is to not play.

Are you kidding? There's loads of this kind of thing out there already. Just call it something sickening like 'Workplace Wellness' and you are good. Though I think they should borrow one of the existing programs from the US military if they want to get the message through to certain people I have encountered in management. Having a drill seargent bellow at them about it not being ok to molest their secretary might ac…

We are getting close.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#25

Post by WordSkill »

> Not harassing women is not enough. > >Now more than ever, we need men to support women–not overlook or avoid them.

They have got to be joking.

If you care about your career, your family and your reputation, you simply do not leave yourself open to even the slightest possibility of being falsely accused of anything, or having someone suddenly “remember” something in ten or twenty years time if you reach the top levels of your industry.

Like it or not, we are back to Victorian rules. At work, you never allow yourself to be alone with a female colleague. You do not strike up casual conversations that could be misconstrued. You do not offer them a lift home. Most importantly, you do not become their mentor, friend, emotional support, or anything beyond polite, respectful, professional interactions directly related to work.

I know, I know, it sounds ridiculous, but our culture has changed. There is an insatiable appetite for scalps, accusations are considered proof, and there is no sign of sanity or reason entering the equation anytime soon. With such potential to rip your life apart, the only sane move is to firewall yourself.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#26

Post by spaniel »

Predictable results

Men are economically more powerful than women, because that's what women want, and it's one way men get sex - yup, sex I a commodity that men want, and women have, and the pay gap squares the trade.

We'll end up with frustrated career women, and sexless men otherwise.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#27

Post by WordSkill »

WeirdFlexButOky wrote: post #7

What the heck. As a (trans) woman who is non-tech in a tech company I find this stat concerning. Just talk to me like a I'm a fellow human, it's not that hard! PS; not too sure what 'working alone' means in terms of a common work activity?

The whole trans thing has become so politicized over the past few years, I suspect a lot of guys would worry that a trans colleague would be far more likely to construe innocent interactions as discrimination.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#28

Post by goldcd »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #23
xupybd wrote: post #5

It’s a simple risk reward call. There is far more risk of accidentally crossing the line with the opposite sex. Yes MeToo has shed light on a lot and no doubt been a net positive but there will be a time until the dust settles and people learn how to work together safely. We no longer have a good formal set of norms for male female interaction. Maybe that could make some sense in situations like the work place where…

"No longer"? #MeToo was about highlighting how many dysfunctional behaviours occurred with the current set of norms, so clearly the old norms didn't work great either.

I suspect that view depends on your gender.

I didn't mean that as a facetious comment. As (hopefully) a non-creepy male I was blissfully unaware of the prevalence. I didn't do it, see it, hear it - and therefore it didn't happen. Therefore nothing to worry about.

Now I know it happens far more frequently that I'd thought, I worry about it. Plus, unlike a lot of other workplace issues, it's.. well currently awkward (for want of a better word) to handle.

If you didn't believe to be somebody involved before, it's a little hard to work out how you should adjust your behaviour.

e.g. "Would you care to join me for dinner after the meetings today, I assure you it is merely to discuss the outcome of the workshops and the day ahead. I can assure you that it is in no way an attempt for me to force you to spend some time with me in the presence of alcohol. I would like to stress I would never try to use my power to seduce you. I tried to ask HR how to ask you out, but they got worried as well. When I said "asked out" just then I didn't mean in a "date" sense, but in a..."

orders room service

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#29

Post by inflatableDodo »

timavr wrote: post #24
inflatableDodo wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you kidding? There's loads of this kind of thing out there already. Just call it something sickening like 'Workplace Wellness' and you are good. Though I think they should borrow one of the existing programs from the US military if they want to get the message through to certain people I have encountered in management. Having a drill seargent bellow at them about it not being ok to molest their secretary might ac…

We are getting close.

You bait and switch it as a military backed outdoor team-building exercise and wait till everyone is half way up a mountain and can't easily get away before getting a six and a half foot transexual marine to terrify them into understanding the concept of intersectionality.

Re: Men, commit to mentor women

#30

Post by timavr »

WordSkill wrote: post #25

> Not harassing women is not enough. > >Now more than ever, we need men to support women–not overlook or avoid them. They have got to be joking. If you care about your career, your family and your reputation, you simply do not leave yourself open to even the slightest possibility of being falsely accused of anything, or having someone suddenly “remember” something in ten or twenty years time if you reach the top leve…

But a result, you treat them unfairly vs male colleagues.

Also same logic can be applied to any minority who is not in power.

I can’t be in room with black, trans-gender, gay, immigrants etc.

So as result the only people who you built relationships are white straight dudes which get promoted.

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