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Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

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Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#361

Post by ranie93 »

jraby3 wrote: post #273
ranie93 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not the OP, and they may be overstating statistics (happy to be shown otherwise). At the same time, wage stagnation is no myth: "From 1973 to 2013, hourly compensation of a typical (production/nonsupervisory) worker rose just 9 percent while productivity increased 74 percent. This breakdown of pay growth has been especially evident in the last decade, affecting both college- and non-college-educated workers as we…

That’s widely quoted but turns out to be incorrect. https://twitter.com/jmhorp/status/1125468274995675138

They claim "median personal income for ALL AGES us up 394.4% since 1977". However a quick check on FRED [0] tells me this figure is way off:

1977: $23,202

2016: $31,099 (2017 not available in the data)

~34% increase

They said they had sources but I only see sources for the price of bread claim. Maybe they aren't looking at real wages? In which case the claim is very misleading. I also agree twitter's thread layout is hard to follow.

[0]https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEPAINUSA672N

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#362

Post by entropea »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #52
WhompingWindows wrote: post #9

Social media's ills, rising wealth and income inequality, rising sea levels, mass extinction event, crumbling roads, shit wages, corruption in government and industry, governments overwhelmingly filled with representatives of other generations with different priorities...there is a huge list of reasons to be pessimistic and they are constantly thrown in our faces online.

Constantly hitting records for economic highs. Lowest unemployment rate for blacks and Hispanics in the history of recorded unemployment rates. Rising wages. Just took a huge step in eradicating HIV in the US by securing free treatment for 200k poor people every year. Between the technological advances in solar/wind/batter, renewed interest in nuclear, and shrinking CO2 it seems climate change is well on its way to b…

Things are only getting better for those blatantly out of touch with the reality of lower classes. Wages are not rising when you factor in Inflation[1], for some portions of the country even going down in buying power since the early 70's. Nearly half of Americans are poor or low income [2].

[1] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/08/07/for-most-us...

[2] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/census-data-half-of-us-poor-or-...

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#363

Post by opportune »

madengr wrote: post #355
opportune wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure most well-paying jobs will pay for your airline tickets and hotels to interview. Not sure why you would take a job in a very high COL city that doesn't cover that type of thing, sounds like you're walking right into poverty

Ditto. It’s been 23 years since I looked for a job, but all 5 interviews out of EE grad school flew me out and paid for hotel, car, etc. Have times changed? This was standard practice back then.

For me no, I'm in my early-mid twenties (granted, I've worked at large tech companies) and every interview I've ever been on paid for all the travel related expenses

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#364

Post by hiram112 »

klodolph wrote: post #12
2819b wrote: post #8

I think it boils down to "comparison being the thief of joy." Social media of all types are basically one giant comparison machine, and the people that are the most visible on social media are the richest/best looking/most successful etc.

I disagree 100%. It's easy to find a scapegoat but the reasons are complex, and from data we know that Millennials and Gen Z are having greater difficulty achieving basic levels of economic stability that were somewhat easier for previous generations. Students are graduating with increasing amounts of debt and entering a job market that can make it tough to pay rent if you don't have experience. It's also easy to say…

> ... the choice between chemistry and chemical engineering. Both majors are STEM and seem quite similar, but chemical engineering is the one with good job prospects.

Anyone know why this is the case? I took chem 1 in college (in the lib arts school), and while it probably wasn't as difficult as most of my classes in the engineering school, it certainly wasn't as easy as, say, the few electives I had to take in sociology, psych, or English.

So why do chemical engineers seem to have it even better than CS or CE majors (in terms of salary and job prospects) while most lib arts chem majors are paid crap and require lots of grad school, even PHDs, to get even an entry level research or similar job in industry?

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#365

Post by mikem170 »

oldjokes wrote: post #194
ranie93 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not the OP, and they may be overstating statistics (happy to be shown otherwise). At the same time, wage stagnation is no myth: "From 1973 to 2013, hourly compensation of a typical (production/nonsupervisory) worker rose just 9 percent while productivity increased 74 percent. This breakdown of pay growth has been especially evident in the last decade, affecting both college- and non-college-educated workers as we…

The really weird thing about wage stagnation is that there are millions of jobs going unfilled, companies are so desperate for people that they can't find anyone and are just dumping cash into stock buybacks instead of raising wages. Something is fundamentally broken in the labor market, it is not responding to supply & demand forces as it has in the past. I am not sure what terminology to use to describe what's goin…

Maybe the price of the product cannot be raised enough to cover the higher cost of an employee?

Maybe those products don't get made, and nobody misses them.

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#366

Post by mindslight »

rukittenme wrote: post #91
crooked-v wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some simple examples, inflation-adjusted home prices have gone up by a factor of 6 and inflation-adjusted education prices have gone up by a factor of 3 over the past few generations [1], while inflation-adjusted average wages have only gone up by $2/hour [2]. That single mom would have had a dramatically easier time providing housing and education for kids even with lower purchasing power for most consumer goods…

You're not accounting for the higher interest rates of the 1980s. Which home would you prefer to buy: $150,000 at 15% over 30 years. $350,000 at 4% over 30 years. Hint : they both have approximately the same total loan cost and payment. You can do this calculation with your parents. My home cost $350k at 3.8%. My parents bought my childhood home for $88k at 8%. Adjust my parents' home price for inflation and run the…

The $150k loan at 15% is generally healthier, as you have increased ability to pay off the principle early by making more than the minimum payments during good times.

The larger principle is only a benefit if you will actually see that money by selling the home. Given that everybody needs a place to live, this will only occur if you sell and retire to a low resource area. Everybody else can only look at the illiquid funny money and pretend.

Never mind that the larger valuation provides a juicier target for eg real estate taxes.

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#367

Post by galfarragem »

Animats wrote: post #285
avmich wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. 300 million people are not registered voters. ~50-60 million are. Each candidate of two in 2016 USA presidential elections got approximately as many votes. So total number of voted - not registered to vote - is twice as much.

2016 popular vote, President: Donald J. Trump Republican 62,980,160 Hillary R. Clinton Democratic 65,845,063 Gary Johnson Libertarian 4,488,931 Jill Stein Green 1,457,050 Evan McMullin Independent 728,830 2000 popular vote, President: George W. Bush Republican 50,456,002 Al Gore Democratic 50,999,897 Ralph Nader Green 2,882,955 Patrick J. Buchanan Reform 448,895 Harry Browne Libertarian 384,431 Howard Phillips Consti…

Devil's advocate (I'm not even American): would the parties' results have been the opposite and the same people that support popular vote would still insist on it?

Or with different words: if you were living in a state with low density, would you still think that strict popular vote is fair?

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#368

Post by refurb »

hiram112 wrote: post #336
Domenic_S wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the world wasn't ending. We grew up in the 90s and early noughts, when ya, there were problems, but they all seemed containable Here are some things I remember from that time off the top of my head: We were on the brink of environmental collapse as CFCs were destroying the ozone layer Acid rain was going to destroy lakes, trees, rivers, eventually killing us all HIV was not well understood and very very scary Waco/…

> We were on the brink of environmental collapse as CFCs were destroying the ozone layer I'd probably be ridiculed by most of the younger crowd here for my views on global warming, I mean climate change, but as someone who distinctly remembers the nonstop warnings of the Ozone Layer - we're all gonna die - I just don't put much energy into worrying about the latest issues related to the environment. Part of me knows…

This is a very insightful comment!

When all you've heard for the past 40 years is the end of the world is around the corner, and that doesn't turn out to be true, you start to tune it out.

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#369

Post by Eleopteryx »

newfriend wrote: post #352
CodeCube wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes ... but I'll be honest, that was extenuating circumstances. Never would have happened were it not for 9/11, so I consider that a black swan event

This is known as "moving the goalposts"

Invoking goalposts in the context of this discussion seems overly combative.

The article deals in pessimism/optimism which is a matter of perception. If one perceives that George W. Bush's success in 2004 was precipitated by extenuating circumstances like 9/11 or the invasion of Iraq, or if they perceive Bush's re-election as an extension of a presidency that never should have been, I would argue that still matters in terms of their outlook. I don't sense that the fact that Bush won the popular vote in 2004 will elevate or depress anyone's perception of the political climate of that decade or right now.

Re: Millennials and Gen Z Increasingly Pessimistic About Their Lives, Survey Finds

#370

Post by malvosenior »

internet_user wrote: post #60
danielecook wrote: post #53

Started chatting with a guy at the airport about work / careers. Within 5 minutes he started ripping on millennials and their work ethic. I am a millennial! Sucks to be saddled with debt after college, have lower paying jobs, and still be shit on by the older generations. And I have things relatively good.

I am also a millennial. The work ethic problem seems to actually exist (from my limited but numerous experiences, including my own), however I am convinced that it is due to learned helplessness. Just imagine hearing your entire life that the world is just about to end any minute now, the icebergs are melting, everything is polluted, everything is so very bad, financial depression, no jobs for you, etc etc. Seems lik…

> Just imagine hearing your entire life that the world is just about to end any minute now, the icebergs are melting, everything is polluted, everything is so very bad, financial depression, no jobs for you, etc etc.

The generations before you experienced this. We fully expected to be destroyed in nuclear holocaust at any moment. There were many nihilistic movements in part because lots of people actually believed humanity was near its end.

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