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The Case for Rooms

citylab.com

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Re: The Case for Rooms

#71

Post by drtz »

djsumdog wrote: post #45
alkonaut wrote: post #7

The open (Kitchen) floor plan to me represents the idea that cooking isn’t a chore separate from eating and socializing. I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Privacy in the kitchen would never be desireable. “Entertaining” doesn’t require guests. There is also a matter of space. A shared living/dining/cooking space can use a lot less space than three separate rooms. I couldn’t afford the separate solution…

I once lived in a Tri-level with a very large and open kitchen. I also lived in a house with very big main rooms but a tiny kitchen. The trouble is everyone congergrates in the kitchen! That's fine if it's nice and wide and has plenty of counter space, but awful if it's really tiny and the only means between the living room and the patio where your other friend is grilling. I agree with other comments on how a dining…

> The trouble is everyone congergrates in the kitchen! That's fine if it's nice and wide and has plenty of counter space, but awful if it's really tiny and the only means between the living room and the patio where your other friend is grilling.

This is one of the many reasons why open floor plans aren't going anywhere. Even without the "entertaining" aspect, people still cook for their families.

I grew up in an early 1900s Coastal Victorian house. While my parents cooked dinner after work in our small kitchen, my brother and I would usually hang out under their feet an in the way. Playing in the living room or upstairs meant we didn't see them until dinner time.

I live in a modern "open concept" now. My wife and I cook dinner after work while the kids play in the dining or living room and nobody has to be forced into isolation. The high-flow If anybody wants alone time, there's a small office downstairs and bedrooms upstairs.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#72

Post by m-p-3 »

DubiousPusher wrote: post #42
alkonaut wrote: post #7

The open (Kitchen) floor plan to me represents the idea that cooking isn’t a chore separate from eating and socializing. I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Privacy in the kitchen would never be desireable. “Entertaining” doesn’t require guests. There is also a matter of space. A shared living/dining/cooking space can use a lot less space than three separate rooms. I couldn’t afford the separate solution…

> I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Exactly my thoughts reading this. I would guess this author does not cook. Or has not done so in a closed isolating kitchen while family or friends chat happily just around a wall out of earshot.

Cooking is kind of a necessary chore to me, so having the opportunity to chat with other guests and not feel left out is a must for me.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#73

Post by SimianLogic2 »

humanrebar wrote: post #63
alkonaut wrote: post #7

The open (Kitchen) floor plan to me represents the idea that cooking isn’t a chore separate from eating and socializing. I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Privacy in the kitchen would never be desireable. “Entertaining” doesn’t require guests. There is also a matter of space. A shared living/dining/cooking space can use a lot less space than three separate rooms. I couldn’t afford the separate solution…

> I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Privacy in the kitchen would never be desireable. When you have small kids: - You want them away from boiling water, dropped knives, and dangerously hot ovens. - You want them to keep sleeping even though you're vacuuming - You might want to let them watch Baby Shark for the 1000th blasted time while leaving you out of it - You might want to read a novel while they ho…

I was the opposite with my kids. I wanted to be able to do stuff in the kitchen while also keeping an eye on them in the living room.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#74

Post by Someone1234 »

Building or converting homes to the open plan style is long term advantageous.

Traditional-roomed homes had load-bearing walls within the interior space. This limited your flexibility to make layout changes. Open plan buildings come with load-bearing beams spanning between exterior walls, meaning that all interior walls are purely for aesthetics or function reasons, and can be almost trivially changed.

This is why modern office buildings have large open plan spaces with pillars. It is super flexible to set up walls (or not) as the space needs. Conference rooms? Private offices? Break-room? Closet? Just tell them where to put the prefab walls.

If you're worried about being in vogue with house layout trends, open plan is the most logical place to begin because rooming off is cheaper than the other way around.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#75

Post by alkonaut »

humanrebar wrote: post #63
alkonaut wrote: post #7

The open (Kitchen) floor plan to me represents the idea that cooking isn’t a chore separate from eating and socializing. I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Privacy in the kitchen would never be desireable. “Entertaining” doesn’t require guests. There is also a matter of space. A shared living/dining/cooking space can use a lot less space than three separate rooms. I couldn’t afford the separate solution…

> I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Privacy in the kitchen would never be desireable. When you have small kids: - You want them away from boiling water, dropped knives, and dangerously hot ovens. - You want them to keep sleeping even though you're vacuuming - You might want to let them watch Baby Shark for the 1000th blasted time while leaving you out of it - You might want to read a novel while they ho…

Ymmv. mine are 5 & 7 and in the last 5 years I have had zero of those problems.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#76

Post by SimianLogic2 »

jpm_sd wrote: post #14

The historical context portion of the article is interesting and well written, but the critique of the open-concept layout at the end seemed rushed and unconvincing. Anyone here who lives in a modern open-concept house care to comment? I currently live with my wife, 3 children and 2 dogs in a 1200 square foot split level and we all dream of a big open-concept house some day... but apparently some people are getting t…

My only complaint would be that my dog is an asshole (our fault, should've never given him people food). I'd love to be able to close the door to the kitchen and leave something out on the counter, but if you don't watch him every second he'll sneak in and grab something.

Other than that I love having a big kitchen, being able to prep food + watch TV. We barely use our dining table (we have a nice bar around our kitchen).

Re: The Case for Rooms

#77

Post by c3534l »

jpm_sd wrote: post #14

The historical context portion of the article is interesting and well written, but the critique of the open-concept layout at the end seemed rushed and unconvincing. Anyone here who lives in a modern open-concept house care to comment? I currently live with my wife, 3 children and 2 dogs in a 1200 square foot split level and we all dream of a big open-concept house some day... but apparently some people are getting t…

I live in a small studio apartment alone. The open floorplan seems to work for me.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#78

Post by Qwertystop »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #68

This really seems like an extended "stop liking what I don't like" rant. There are legitimate reasons to prefer either open or closed kitchens, and most of them come down to personal preference. Personally, I like being in open, airy spaces. It's got nothing to do with "entertaining." Also, this: > A large, single, continuous space is harder to get and keep clean. Messes and smells are no longer isolated, but can be…

It's easier to sweep four small rooms than one big room without. With a big room I usually mentally break it into smaller sections to sweep one at a time, so as to always have a pile nearby whichever bit of floor is currently being swept, and then inevitably some of the dust from one section blows into somewhere I'd already finished.

If the small rooms have thresholds, that helps too; that's what they're for.

Also you can do one room today and the next tomorrow; that holds for vacuuming as well as sweeping.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#79

Post by alkonaut »

batrat wrote: post #70
DubiousPusher wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I want to cook for an hour without being alone. Exactly my thoughts reading this. I would guess this author does not cook. Or has not done so in a closed isolating kitchen while family or friends chat happily just around a wall out of earshot.

> I would guess this author does not cook Exactly the opposite. People with open floor plans don't cook every day, otherwise their home will smell like a cheap restaurant, unless they got used to it. My parents have an open plan, i don't. My home smells fresh every day (except kitchen) despite cooking every day, their house, smells like food in every corner because the smell impregnates in every material(especially i…

This must mean the fans aren’t powerful enough which seems strange if the house is reasonably modern. I once lived in a place with no proper duct to the outside at all (just a fan with a filter but recycling air) and in that place I avoided frying anything. If course no fan is perfect and if I’m frying something it will be noticeable in adjacent rooms, but I want the smell of cooking to be noticed in the house. It’s usually a positive thing. It does disappear again. If I hated it I’d rather buy a more powerful fan than have a kitchen door.

Re: The Case for Rooms

#80

Post by ChuckMcM »

And here I thought it was going to be about office space :-)

More seriously though, the original open floor plan was the tipi or the igloo. Separate rooms for everything was explicitly a way to show off wealth by having portions of your living space dedicated to non-essential activities.

When people put aside the bragging aspects having multiple rooms, it is more functionally useful to have a larger open space which can be configured dynamically for different activities.

The discussion of the kitchen is fairly reasonable. The kitchen is a functional room and not something you generally use for other things (or at least the part with all the appliances). Most people don't share their garage either as its a functional storage space for their car (or excess possessions depending on how see things :)). A kitchenette (just a few preparation tools and one preparation area) certainly works well sharing the space with other things where people gather and snack, but kitchens with giant Wolf ranges, extended racks of cookware, and more stainless steel than a battleship are a bit out of place. I think those go back to showing off wealth rather than being practical :-)

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