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Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

derrickreimer.com

81–90 of 221 posts

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#81
post #54

The way I see it, it's not that people don't like Slack, it's that people don't like online chatting in general as the official way of communicating inside a company. I don't think that the solution to that problem could ever be another chatting tool.

Yes I honestly have no idea what problems in our workflow chat would solve, but I can think of loads of problems it would introduce.

I have no idea how other programmers tolerate chat as a communications medium for work. Why would you prefer chat over other async mediums?

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#82
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it does make sense. Funded businesses die all the time. Google cancels products all the time. companies are acquihired and products end of lifed. Even within organizations there are critically important employees. So, no, it doesn't make sense.

At this point in time, Slack is a billion dollar unicorn that can magic money out of wherever it needs to keep going as long as it wants. It's not going away any time soon. The worst case scenario for Slack is acquisition and long slow death over a decade.

All it takes is one information leakage scandal, and customers will abandon Slack at the drop of a hat. It's just a chat app, so it's very easy to replace.

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#83

I read this, and all through the article I kept waiting for the part where the author would talk about his own experience using his own product. What I'm getting at is that, its really difficult to get people to love something you build unless you love it yourself, Seth Godin touches on this in his book "This is Marketing" I like the data driven approach to product development, but sometimes passion trumps data, if y…

> then my answer to you is like that punchline in the Famous "Coming to America" skit ...

Don't find it but it sounds fun! Got a link?

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#84
post #4

"The gist is that it’s tough to get unbiased feedback during customer validation." - I wish this was taught along with lean startup content. Too many times I have heard founders say they validated the idea when all they have done is gotten biased feedback while asking self-fulfilling questions.

Huh. I think this is often taught. Indeed, I think it's at the core of the LS approach. The build-measure-learn loop is the heart of the process, meaning that whatever ideas you have, you test them as soon as possible with customer behavior.

As an example, I mentored at Lean Startup Machine. We'd have them form up into teams around ideas. The first thing they'd ask for was verbal feedback. But they were quickly supposed to move to increasing levels of demonstration of commitment.

One team, for example, had the notion that restaurants needed an easier way to get insight into customer experiences. They went out and found restaurant managers, and first confirmed that they had the hypothesized problem. But they quickly moved beyond words, asking if the managers would be willing to let them trial the system in the restaurant. Since enough of them said yes, they build something simple and put those little printed cardboard triangles on a bunch of tables. They then hacked together reports for the managers based on the data collected. The managers liked the reports. They then asked the managers how many would be willing to pay, right then, some modest monthly charge for ongoing use of the system.

If I recall rightly, this team discovered that when actual money was on the line, the reports were just a nice-to-have. In that situation, it's still reasonable to persevere, as you may have hypotheses about what really will get them to cross the line. But it's also reasonable to kill the idea.

There's a big difference, though, between what is taught and what people do. I was an early adopter of both the Agile movement (XP in particular) and Lean Startup approaches, and in both cases I'm kinda horrified by what it turned into in practice. With the Agile movement, it was quickly captured by companies who wanted to feel like they were doing something different while still retaining most of their top-down pathologies and high-debt code bases.

With the Lean Startup approach it's harder to say how it turned out, as early-stage startups rarely produce reports like this. But my general impression is that, as with Agile, people pick the parts that seem fun and easy, and avoid the hard parts. I think this was made worse by the flood of VC money, especially around Uber-for-X startups. Who wants a method that will kill your probably-bad idea early if you can get tens or hundreds of millions? The bad idea might work out or you might thrash your way to a good one. And if it still failed? Well, now you're a seasoned founder of a venture-backed startup. By some measures, although not mine, that's way better than having a quiet, cheap failure.

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#85
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point in time, Slack is a billion dollar unicorn that can magic money out of wherever it needs to keep going as long as it wants. It's not going away any time soon. The worst case scenario for Slack is acquisition and long slow death over a decade.

All it takes is one information leakage scandal, and customers will abandon Slack at the drop of a hat. It's just a chat app, so it's very easy to replace.

I am willing to bet that 99% of users will not blink an eye if there was an information leak. See Equifax, Facebook..

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#86
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chat is a complement to email, not a replacement. Over time some people may take their formerly-email activities to chat, but no cutover is required. Running two chat systems side by side, on the other hand, is a huge pain. There really is a pressure to get everything migrated and the old one turned off.

Email is for outside the boundaries (outside-of-company, outside-of-division in a silo'd company), chat is for inside - there's still people who do prefer email especially in partner facing roles, but I think its fair to say that most prefer using chat if they had a choice.

Email feels more asynchronous than chat. With an email, I don't expect an immediate answer, and I expect a better-researched answer.

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#87
> “Ugh, Slack distracts me so often. You’re right; everything feels urgent even when it’s not. I’m super interested in what you’re building here. We’re pretty open to change at my company – I don’t see switching being too big of a deal.”

This is such a common mistake. When doing customer development, do NOT stick to asking "would this be of general interest to you?". In fact, you can get away with not asking this at all. Instead ask: "how much would you pay for this?" And if you like the price tag, also throw in: "can we set a date to sign next week/month/quarter?"

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#89
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's one of those subjective things with design and why we have so many cars/etc to choose from. To each his/her own. I personally like the design.

It's not subjective. We usually sit right at the center of our main monitor for a reason. Reading that website on a large 32'' monitor is annoying.

> It's not subjective.

Oh, please. You may have some rationale that makes a certain kind of sense, but clearly a lot of others don't care, or value other things. So ... subjective.

Re: Walking Away from the Product I Spent a Year Building

#90
post #54

The way I see it, it's not that people don't like Slack, it's that people don't like online chatting in general as the official way of communicating inside a company. I don't think that the solution to that problem could ever be another chatting tool.

Yes I honestly have no idea what problems in our workflow chat would solve, but I can think of loads of problems it would introduce. I have no idea how other programmers tolerate chat as a communications medium for work. Why would you prefer chat over other async mediums?

Chat is just as async as email or any online communication platform - there's no obligation to respond immediately, and you can disable notifications for as long as you please.
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