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Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

asia.nikkei.com

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Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#161

Post by la_barba »

shmerl wrote: post #35
chronogram wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that Google streaming gaming thing not Google being "lock-in jerks" then?

In their context, lock-in could happen if they'll start pushing exclusives. But in technology sense, they are advancing common stack (Linux / Vulkan), unlike MS and Sony who use tools lock-in to discourage platform development by making it more costly.

Can you explain how its not a lock-in? It seems to require a Google account and is limited to games that are blessed by google. AFAIK, I don't think I can download Stadia and run it on a home server and stream games to multiple PCs in my own home. If Google made it open source, then yes, I'm 100% with you...

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#162

Post by kibibu »

DontGiveTwoFlux wrote: post #159
romwell wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I have no idea how reliable it is This is not reliable at all. You can really feel 100ms latency. That's why in the world of pro music, barely anything above 10ms keypress-to-sound latency is deemed acceptable. Quake III will make all these streamed games feel slow .

Well sound uses different neural pathways than audio, so it's not a totally fair comparison.

Is this a typo? Anyway, audio feedback is a critical part of games. Pressing the "fire" button and waiting 100ms for the sound of the gun would be insanely noticeable

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#163

Post by kingosticks »

shpx wrote: post #126
Waterluvian wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And Nvidia GeForce Now. I'm wildly impressed by Nvidia's streaming solution.

By the way, Nvidia GeForce Now is free right now. Go sign up for their free beta and a couple months later you'll get an invitation https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/products/geforce-now/wa...

Is it available for Linux? I can only find info about Windows PC and Mac. One of the main appeals to me of streaming services is I don't need Windows to play the latest games, in theory at least...

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#164

Post by HeWhoLurksLate »

skohan wrote: post #83
cududa wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft has been working on this ~2008. Google only started a few years ago.

Yeah but Google has serious bonafides as far as delivering high-res video at scale. Stadia is just Youtube with input handling and a game renderer instead of video files producing the frames.

I'm going to bet that YouTube's experiences with interframe compression will help them out a lot in this regard, as it could help them remove some of the data they need to transmit.

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#165

Post by tetha »

I am sad with this threads discussion. Or I'm old. This is a logical step in lock-in disguised as user experience.

Back in the day, if you could maintain the data, my 15 physical 3.5 inch rather unfloppy floppies were monkey island. I lost my personal copy, but if I moved the data, I could have my own copy of monkey island right here. I personally failed on my own maintenance there.

Then we had - skipping some steps - something like private WoW Servers. they worked 90% of the way. But Blizzard kept some code and that never worked privately. Most stuff worked on the client side, most stuff on the server side could be reverse engineered.

And now we're planning to stream games via something similar to team viewer / citrix, put bluntly. At this point, what difference is there to an interactive movie? I can replay several single player games I acquired on steam off-line as long as I have the binary and a windows instance. I'm sure I can play FTL or slay the spire in 2040 without any developer interference.

If you stream those games, those games will die harder than the multitude of multiplayer only games with dead servers once the streaming servers get shutdown due to business decisions. Which can and will happen < 1 year after a failed launch in my book.

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#166

Post by la_barba »

skohan wrote: post #41
chronogram wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And OpenGL and Metal, and even the web! With a sweeping generalisation I'm going to say that a games company is either too small to care about the graphics API, or too big to care.

Tell that to graphics programmers. Imagine how much better performance you could expect from games if they could spend their time optimizing for one API, and not making compromises to target a half dozen.

> Imagine how much better performance you could expect from games if they could spend their time optimizing for one API, and not making compromises to target a half dozen.

That is not really an accurate statement. Graphics performance is heavily dependent on the actual hardware design of the underlying platform. You can't wave a magic API-wand and have your executable or shader be magically fast on every hardware platform.

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#167

Post by Jyaif »

skohan wrote: post #84
Jyaif wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible. The trick is to render the pictures using the latest position of the headset. Include depth maps to make the rendering more accurate. Use ML to in-paint the gaps.

But the rendering happens at the server. You'd still need a local GPU to do reprojection for the headset.

Yes, but you need a GPU to decode 4k video anyways.

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#168

Post by p1necone »

tetha wrote: post #165

I am sad with this threads discussion. Or I'm old. This is a logical step in lock-in disguised as user experience. Back in the day, if you could maintain the data, my 15 physical 3.5 inch rather unfloppy floppies were monkey island. I lost my personal copy, but if I moved the data, I could have my own copy of monkey island right here. I personally failed on my own maintenance there. Then we had - skipping some steps…

Agreed. If we go full in on game streaming we can kiss actually preserving the art goodbye entirely. At least with streaming of non interactive media we can rip it to a hard drive somewhere.

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#169

Post by tlear »

DontGiveTwoFlux wrote: post #159
romwell wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I have no idea how reliable it is This is not reliable at all. You can really feel 100ms latency. That's why in the world of pro music, barely anything above 10ms keypress-to-sound latency is deemed acceptable. Quake III will make all these streamed games feel slow .

Well sound uses different neural pathways than audio, so it's not a totally fair comparison.

100ms is pretty bad in shooter. Around 60-70 is where I cant distinguish the difference. But I am very far from a great player.

I can see this working very well for games like Total War where hardware specs are super high but response time is not critical

Re: Sony and Microsoft set rivalry aside for cloud gaming alliance

#170

Post by wuliwong »

tetha wrote: post #165

I am sad with this threads discussion. Or I'm old. This is a logical step in lock-in disguised as user experience. Back in the day, if you could maintain the data, my 15 physical 3.5 inch rather unfloppy floppies were monkey island. I lost my personal copy, but if I moved the data, I could have my own copy of monkey island right here. I personally failed on my own maintenance there. Then we had - skipping some steps…

I can understand that you dislike the idea of being beholden to a 3rd party in order to run your game but you lost me with

>At this point, what difference is there to an interactive movie?

What is an interactive movie and how does having a game stream from a remote server change a video game into one of these things?

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