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I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

theguardian.com

291–300 of 325 posts

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#291
post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, just maybe, the feds and the states (in the US) should pass laws like this: Employers are liable to the government for four times the cost of providing SNAP (f/k/a food stamps), public housing, and other welfare benefits to their employees. 1/3 of any fines collected in this way would be payable to citizens who report the problems. It's totally unfair for the taxpayers to subsidize businesses by feeding and ho…

Hiring someone to work part time who has a spouse with a good full time job: totally fine. Hiring someone to work part time who is a single mother: company gets saddled with massive fines. Doesn't seem like the best plan.

You can probably work in some kind of FTE exemption.

It would need careful writing, otherwise it might introduce more precarity by encouraging employers not to offer full time contracts.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Redistributing Walmart's store managers wealth is a really poor example when you don't even look at executive salaries or dividends. > The problem is fundamentally this: A typical Wal-Mart store has around 300 employees. If you take the manager's entire $100,000 and distribute it to the employees, they each get less than $500/year, a raise of less than $0.25/hour. Walmart has 2,867,125,000 shares outstanding * $1.96…

> Walmart has 2,867,125,000 shares outstanding * $1.96 per quarter * 4 = $22,478,260,000 per year spent on dividends alone. Where did you get those dividend values? According to this [0], annual dividend was $2,08 per share for fiscal year 2019. [0] - https://news.walmart.com/2019/02/19/walmart-raises-annual-di...

You are right. Misread MSN Money. Google Finance by default shows quarterly, but G Finance is terrible now. MSN Money by default shows annual.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was watching a sitcom called Superstore a little while ago, features the employees in a Wal-Mart like store, and the protagonist got a promotion to the head of the store. There was a whole plot line about how her wage was now in the 6 figures, and I was incredulous until I did a bit of research - Wal-Mart store managers can absolutely make that much money while their employees live in poverty. How you could make th…

>How you could make that much and expect loyalty and sacrifice from your staff who make a fraction of that, I won't ever know. All those Walmart store managers make 6 figures as you say, some as much as $250k, but the one thing they can always fall back on is they all started out as a low paid Walmart employee as well. It doesn’t change the inequality dynamics but it’s better than something like this story of the hea…

I didn't know that Walmart store managers were that well paid. And to be certain, they pay a lot more than 7.25/hr to their lowest paid employees!

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#294
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was watching a sitcom called Superstore a little while ago, features the employees in a Wal-Mart like store, and the protagonist got a promotion to the head of the store. There was a whole plot line about how her wage was now in the 6 figures, and I was incredulous until I did a bit of research - Wal-Mart store managers can absolutely make that much money while their employees live in poverty. How you could make th…

Why do you think anyone expects “loyalty and sacrifice” for minimum wage at Walmart! sacrifice? c’mon

Walmarts min pay is a lot higher than min wage in most states.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There was a whole plot line about how her wage was now in the 6 figures, and I was incredulous until I did a bit of research - Wal-Mart store managers can absolutely make that much money while their employees live in poverty. The problem is fundamentally this: A typical Wal-Mart store has around 300 employees. If you take the manager's entire $100,000 and distribute it to the employees, they each get less than $500…

Redistributing Walmart's store managers wealth is a really poor example when you don't even look at executive salaries or dividends. > The problem is fundamentally this: A typical Wal-Mart store has around 300 employees. If you take the manager's entire $100,000 and distribute it to the employees, they each get less than $500/year, a raise of less than $0.25/hour. Walmart has 2,867,125,000 shares outstanding * $1.96…

> Walmart has 2,867,125,000 shares outstanding * $1.96 per quarter * 4 = $22,478,260,000 per year spent on dividends alone.

Their quarterly dividend is ~$0.53/share:

https://stock.walmart.com/investors/stock-information/divide...

Moreover, let's suppose you take that entire amount and give it to the employees. Then the company has zero ROI and the stock value drops to the level that it's profitable for corporate raiders to buy the company to liquidate its real estate holdings etc., and everyone loses their jobs.

Shareholders get paid because they invested money. You can't avoid paying them market rates unless you can operate without capital. Somebody has to pay for the land the store sits on and the trucks that deliver the goods. They have to get a return if you want to get an investment.

> I haven't even looked at executive salaries or the costs from lawsuits Walmart gets from it's shady tactics.

The numbers for top level executives will be even less valuable than for store managers, because they get paid hundreds of times more money but have ten thousand times more employees under them.

> If Walmart can't pay that then maybe they deserve to fail and Costco, which does pay well and comply with the law, can take their place.

Costco can't replace Walmart because Walmart customers can't afford membership fees and bulk purchases, or they would already buy at Costco. The thing that replaces Walmart is dollar stores. That is not an improvement for anybody.

> Compared to Microsoft or Apple, which can easily afford to pay the contract labor they use in place of union janitors, technicians, drivers, etc. Despite their margins they still use it and those people live in poverty because of it.

Those people live in poverty because the cost of necessities is high compared to the value of unskilled labor. If janitors at other companies make $8/hour, Microsoft isn't going to pay more just because they have more money.

To improve the lives of those people, what you need is either more demand for labor or more supply (i.e. lower prices) for necessities.

> Microsoft, Apple, Wall Street banks, even McDonalds is a better example.

None of these companies are good examples because they're all titans. The large majority of people work for small and medium businesses with low margins. Setting policy based on Apple and McDonalds is exactly how you get policies that only work for Apple and McDonalds. You destroy the small businesses that actually employ people and drive the demand for labor while you increase corporate profits and consumer prices from the lack of competition.

Forget about punishing Walmart and McDonalds. Figure out how to make it easier for the family owned corner store to better compete with them. Figure out how to reduce housing and education costs.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#296
post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but Employer-B now has employees who DGAF about anything in the business, and often have an adversarial, even 'eff them! attitude to the business. Employer-B's customer service and general care of its facilities & inventory will suck, and they will have much higher turnover costs, even if they have better products. So, what is the relative advantage? Moreover, the article was specifically about the tradeoff in…

There’s a reason Walmart and Dollar General are crushing others, and it’s because either their customers can’t afford good customer service or they don’t care for it and choose to shop there anyway. The proof is literally the fact that mom and pop stores and others like Sears went out of business, customers preferred saving $5 over good customer service. As I prefaced above, this is true for business where customers…

I have had no better customer service at Mom and Pops than at Walmart, maybe it is just my area.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#297
post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hiring someone to work part time who has a spouse with a good full time job: totally fine. Hiring someone to work part time who is a single mother: company gets saddled with massive fines. Doesn't seem like the best plan.

You can probably work in some kind of FTE exemption. It would need careful writing, otherwise it might introduce more precarity by encouraging employers not to offer full time contracts.

Indeed it might. No matter how careful the writing.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. I know you think you’re arguing against me, but what you described supports my position.

It isn't incompetence, it's complacent acceptance of a toxic norm for personal gain.

Fine, incompetence is the wrong word, but malice isn't the right word.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#299

I wish redistribution to the very bottom was a bigger part of the political debate. Our politics is currently focused on redistribution from the very top to the middle class. (Stuff like free college or universal healthcare would primarily benefit the top half, because those folks are the ones who are in a position to be accepted to and attend college, and aren’t already covered by Medicaid.) The math of that is toug…

That’s interesting. I’ve always seen the promotion of free college and universal healthcare as one of promoting equal opportunity to all. While the lowest income groups have historically had low college participation, I saw it as a reflection of a class of people not even daring to dream an impossible dream, as it would cost too much. Making it free would of course change the idea around it.

The poor are eligible for Pell Grants, which covers 60% of the tuition of the average public college, and historically covered even more. Nonetheless, college completion rates for the bottom quantile are 1/4 that of the top quintile. There are many other barriers to college attendance for the poor. There is a large opportunity cost—if you are attending college, you can’t work to support your family. To the contrary, your family still has to support you. The social fabric in poor neighborhoods often are frayed, with gangs and drugs and crime distracting kids from school. As a result, children from poor areas often aren’t motivated to apply to college, wouldn’t be accepted even if they applied nor would they be prepared for college coursework if they were admitted. The end result is that most people benefitting from free college would be middle class people who don’t have those other barriers.

If you look at countries that have free college, most have college completion rates similar to or lower than the US: https://www.in.gov/che/files/DMatthews.pdf. The vast majority of the EU population lives in the U.K., Germany, Italy, France, and Spain. All of those countries have lower college completion rates among people 25-34 than the US, even with tuition being cheap or free in those other countries. While tuition is not a barrier to college attendance in say Germany, college is still primarily something for the middle and upper middle class.

Programs that theoretically offer “equal opportunity to all,” but where the middle class gain the lion’s share of benefits, is not an efficient way to better the lives of the poor.

(The same thing with Medicare for All versus the ACA. In Europe, the middle class pay for their own health care, and also subsidize the poor. In Germany, public health insurance premiums are 15% of income, with folks making above $70,000 being exempt from the public system. The ACA is similar—premiums are capped at 0-10% of income for folks making less than $50,000. That’s even more generous than the German system for folks making low incomes. The folks who feel the pinch are middle class people, for whom a 10% premium is a lot when they’re used to having a much lower tax burden than what they would have in Germany. Consequently, replacing ACA with Medicare for All would primarily benefit middle class people, especially if funded through a progressive tax.)

The plight of the poor (who are worse off in the US than the poor in the big EU countries), is unfortunately being used as a fig leaf. The American middle class (who are better off than the middle class in the big EU countries) wants the safety and security of a European style welfare system, but doesn’t want to pay a 40% tax as they would in Europe, a 20% VAT, etc. Even though you could dramatically improve the lives of the bottom 50% through targeted programs, progress on that front gets held hostage to a broader push to have the rich pay for middle class welfare.

Re: I froze the salaries of my executive team to benefit other workers

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more that they are out of touch, IMHO. They have absolutely no concept of how far $7.50/hr goes so they just say their employees need to budget better. Perhaps if senior executives received minimum wage paychecks for two months (and no bonuses), they might gain some empathy.

You can't gain empathy when something is temporary. Most of the stress of being poor comes of worry about how to handle long term problems / the fact that life has no point except slaving away. That cannot be replicated without genuinely taking everything away from a person.

I disagree, if reading books can increase empathy [0], then I'd expect any activity that forced you to experience the way another person lives would do the same.

[0] https://science.sciencemag.org/content/342/6156/377

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