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Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

reuters.com

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Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#41

Post by jhpriestley »

dcolkitt wrote: post #22
drchewbacca wrote: post #2

Personally I can't do more than 2-3 hours of genuine "deep work" per day. That is high quality, focused, immersed thinking on a difficult problem and writing code. IMO people who work a large number of hours each week get cognitively slowed. They can't tell they've slowed down (partly because they don't have a control to compare against) and so think that if you do 80 hours per week you'll do twice as much as if you…

Intuitively and introspectively I agree with you. But then I ask myself, where are all the successful 30-hour week companies? Why is it that nearly every single successful organization has a culture of long hours? I personally know that I can't sustainably work 10+ hours a day. But the observed results in the real world seem to say something different. It's hard to square that circle, and I'm genuinely interested in…

Working long hours together serves purposes besides productivity, like signaling commitment and building social cohesion. "Unproductive" hardship is common in social organizations, e.g. fraternity hazing, military bootcamp, various vows of abstinence by monks, marathons for charitable causes.

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#42

Post by C1sc0cat »

TheOperator wrote: post #14
drchewbacca wrote: post #2

Personally I can't do more than 2-3 hours of genuine "deep work" per day. That is high quality, focused, immersed thinking on a difficult problem and writing code. IMO people who work a large number of hours each week get cognitively slowed. They can't tell they've slowed down (partly because they don't have a control to compare against) and so think that if you do 80 hours per week you'll do twice as much as if you…

I wouldn't cargo cult everything leaders like Jack Ma propose just because they're highly successful. Sure some 996er's at a company at say, the senior management level can be worth it since you do actually get more work done. Abliet incredibly inefficiently while getting paid the entire time. I don't see how its efficient to have the core of your business being nothing but employees who are working at decreased effi…

They would be salaried - I suspect if these 996 legally had to be paid overtime the practice would quickly stop.

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#43

Post by C1sc0cat »

whoevercares wrote: post #25
hh42 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked for a Silicon Valley company. And now I am an employee of the Chinese 'A' company. There are endless features we have to develop. As a developer, I also need to concern about the business value of our project. Basically, I should handle two times of work than before.

That’s true. I heard Chinese internet CTOs saying this about a feature that took a year to launch in NA when they do recruiting in CA: “We can deliver this in two weeks with the same team size”

So? In the UK I and another developer delivered in a month what another part of the companies would take 18 months.

And we where physically not allowed to be in the office (BT Princess street) outside normal working hours because embarrassing security cockups six months before involving the Queens unlisted numbers :-)

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#44

Post by AFascistWorld »

High-paying and comfortable jobs(government jobs, state-owned companies; for example you need to bribe like 30K usd to stay in the military and get promoted) in China are reserved for people with connections, even then they hardly have to do anything if show up at all, there's a hierarchy, those who don't need to work and those who have to work extra.

So while the examples in this story sound good, but majority of people don't really have a choice.

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#45

Post by unicornmama »

drchewbacca wrote: post #2

Personally I can't do more than 2-3 hours of genuine "deep work" per day. That is high quality, focused, immersed thinking on a difficult problem and writing code. IMO people who work a large number of hours each week get cognitively slowed. They can't tell they've slowed down (partly because they don't have a control to compare against) and so think that if you do 80 hours per week you'll do twice as much as if you…

For the last month I have tracked my productivity with a spreadsheet. I punch out between breaks, lunch, Reddit, etc.

On a typical day I average 2-3 hours. Hitting 4-5 hours or more I feel burnt out.

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#46

Post by oarabbus_ »

drchewbacca wrote: post #2

Personally I can't do more than 2-3 hours of genuine "deep work" per day. That is high quality, focused, immersed thinking on a difficult problem and writing code. IMO people who work a large number of hours each week get cognitively slowed. They can't tell they've slowed down (partly because they don't have a control to compare against) and so think that if you do 80 hours per week you'll do twice as much as if you…

>Executives who think the best way to measure business performance is by how much your employees are sat at their desks are idiots.

From what bloggers say online, this is how Japan works in general.

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#47

Post by JohnFen »

TheOperator wrote: post #18
apabepa wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recall hearing/reading that a lot of the time in the office is passive/suboptimal. The productivity gain is that you have the people there in standby. The gain is that the important work that do happen is not blocked by people being off work since you can pull them in instantly compared to "Only Bob knows X and he left for the day, lets schedule a meeting tomorrow"

Or you could just schedule people to arrive at the same time but have them work shorter hours.

Or stagger shifts so that there's always someone at the ready.

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#48

Post by JohnFen »

matz1 wrote: post #8
drchewbacca wrote: post #2

Personally I can't do more than 2-3 hours of genuine "deep work" per day. That is high quality, focused, immersed thinking on a difficult problem and writing code. IMO people who work a large number of hours each week get cognitively slowed. They can't tell they've slowed down (partly because they don't have a control to compare against) and so think that if you do 80 hours per week you'll do twice as much as if you…

996 doesn't necessarily mean working 72 hours nonstop. You can still do 2-3 hours works then breaks, then another 2-3 hours works.

That sounds even worse...

Re: Some of China’s '996' tech tribe quit, seek less stress

#49

Post by sushisushisushi »

nickthemagicman wrote: post #27

I love how there's tons of hype from leaders to have employees work more hours but not so much hype to PAY THEM MORE. It's just your DUTY?

It makes sense when you understand that those at the top really don't view the rest of us in the same terms that they view each other. We're not accorded the same hopes, dreams, desires, needs, etc. They're special; we're not. Everything they do, morally speaking, proceeds from that premise.
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