By the way the whole idea of passports is barely a century old and was a temporary measure for WWI.
Beware scope creep.
Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
71–80 of 222 posts
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#72Am I the only one spooked by the fact that to opt out, you now need to have your passport with you? (and for _domestic travel_ no less) Given that the facial databases contain your data regardless, and the amount of in-airport surveillance (in that you're not gonna avoid being observed and logged), It's more of a, "we're gonna make you present your papers regardless, pick your poison"
Are they actually using this on domestic flights? I know the article mentions flying domestically but I haven't seen any evidence that this is being used for non-international flights. The whole point of this is to implement the Congressional mandate for exit tracking without the more traditional exit controls of getting your passport checked and stamped upon exit (which most countries do).
I thought so too, so your comment prompted me to look it up. Seems like the enforcement of this requirement will begin on October 1st 2020.[1]
[1] https://www.dhs.gov/news/2019/04/04/tsa-reminds-travelers-re...
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#73Earlier quoted context omitted.
I travel with work a lot. Seems normal to carry some ID like a passport when travelling, to me. Hotels often ask for ID. You don’t know if your plans will change and you’ll need to fly straight to another country, etc.
You’re atypical. People don’t usually have that happen to them (the domestic to international).
I got the impression they fly international and didn't see we're talking about domestic.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#74The pieces of the puzzle that all go together: REAL ID, federalizes drivers licenses for creating a database of photos for facial recognition and metadata. Enhanced Passport--the requirements for getting the photo include not wearing glasses and not smiling, ostensibly so that their algorithm works better. Facial scanning at airports, so they can build up as big a database as possible. I'm surprised they didn't requi…
In Georgia they’ve been requiring a finger print in some cases for some time. Not all fingers but I remember my index and/or thumb being scanned. I let my license expire and had to go through the joys of trying to prove my address and other stuff like the finger scan.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#75Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I used to be skeptical of this stuff, too. Then, we had 18 years of no major terrorist attacks. We had 17 years of no major terrorist attacks that involved airplanes prior to 9/11; if you count the foiled plot, you could bump it down to six: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_airliner_bombing_a... And we've had plenty of terrorist attacks since 9/11, we just don't call them that - we call them "lone wolves":…
None of those meet the “Major” criteria.
Nothing can fit a criteria someone makes up on the spot in response to counter-arguments.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
>I'm surprised they didn't require full fingerprints for REAL ID. They do in California!
California has required a thumb print for a drivers license since 1982.
Is this true for all drivers? When I moved to California and got my driver's license I don't remember having my thumb print taken. I've even considered it a badge of honor that I've never given my fingerprints to the man.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#77Am I the only one spooked by the fact that to opt out, you now need to have your passport with you? (and for _domestic travel_ no less) Given that the facial databases contain your data regardless, and the amount of in-airport surveillance (in that you're not gonna avoid being observed and logged), It's more of a, "we're gonna make you present your papers regardless, pick your poison"
AFAIK this is only for international travel, so you should be bringing your passport with you regardless.
The article says otherwise.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#78Earlier quoted context omitted.
That seems like hyperbole to me. Remember, we live in a republican democracy. Yes, it works slowly (by design). But, it works. At least we don’t have a totalitarian state to deal with. I used to be skeptical of this stuff, too. Then, we had 18 years of no major terrorist attacks.
I think OP's point is that many of the tools necessary for a totalitarian state are in place. The Stasi and NKVD would have loved tools like this. America once aspired to something other than "papers please".
> America once aspired to something other than "papers please".
If you're reading this, I highly recommend the game Papers Please[0]. It's not... fun per se, but it is engaging and very interesting. Definitely worth a try.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
That seems like hyperbole to me. Remember, we live in a republican democracy. Yes, it works slowly (by design). But, it works. At least we don’t have a totalitarian state to deal with. I used to be skeptical of this stuff, too. Then, we had 18 years of no major terrorist attacks.
How do we not have a totalitarian state? You can't publish evidence of state war crimes without the CIA doing a character assassination job on you (pending a real assassination). You can't travel anonymously. You can't publish anonymously. You can't make bank transfers out of the country for arbitrary purposes. You can't deposit or withdraw cash above a trivial amount without significant scrutiny which is reported to…
What you're describing is authoritarian, not totalitarian. A totalitarian state has only one political party with all others being banned.
Re: Americans can opt out of airport facial recognition
#80Earlier quoted context omitted.
me too. those peeping tom machines are such a farce in the overall tragedy that is security theater.
Yes, thanks L3 Systems and asshat Chertoff for creating the "shoe bomber" and getting your shit sold. Enjoy your billions and rot in hell.
I'd guess most people here agree with your underlying view, but please don't post in this flamewar/ranty style to HN. It lowers signal/noise and encourages worse from others.