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U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

bloomberg.com

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Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#71

Post by techntoke »

shmerl wrote: post #62
jtbayly wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this meant to be sarcastic? I suppose it would be possible if you enslaved those with PHDs and unpaid debt, forcing them to teach at universities administrated by those enslaved for their debt, built by those enslaved for their debt. Pharaoh had a lot of things for “free,” as did the plantation owners in the US, but the cost of free is pretty much the opposite of free for those who end up doing the paying. And the…

I'm serious. Society can figure out how to make education free, and not put students in crazy debt for years. If you don't advocate it, you basically advocate debt profiteering.

Lots of people advocate for abusing others because they benefit from it and never see any consequences.

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#72

Post by [deleted] »

Thorrez wrote: post #67
xfitm3 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

College educations don't really impart substantial knowledge. It's the ability to put it on your resume that counts.

I got substantial knowledge from my degree. But regardless of whether you got any knowledge from your degree, you could still get enjoyment from your degree. And even if you didn't get any knowledge or enjoyment from your degree, if you remove the ability to put it on your resume, how is someone supposed to become "fully employed"?

[deleted]

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#73

Post by anigbrowl »

TallGuyShort wrote: post #30
anticensor wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Education has yourself as return.

If you can't find gainful employment with your new degree, not much worth repossessing, is there?

We teach kids they can be whoever they want to be, then stick them with a massive bill and say 'ha ha only kidding you miserable debt slave.'

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#74

Post by iamtheworstdev »

nicoburns wrote: post #34
rayiner wrote: post #33

I’m convinced you can’t fix the education problem in the US until you can fix the demand side as well. Where I live in Maryland, you can do two years at the local community college (which is excellent) for $8,000 in tuition and fees (total), before finishing up at a four year-college. Very few people take advantage of the opportunity. Why are people clamoring for free college when they’re not using the cheaper option…

Because most people who study are looking to use their qualification to further their careers, and hiring tends to be very reputation based. It's that demand that would need to change.

Which, ironically, works in your favor in Virginia (USA). In Virginia if you get your associates through a community college then public institutions, like Virginia Tech or University of Virginia, cannot deny you entry if you want to get your undergrad degree. And there's no resume requirement to list where you got your Associates later on.

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#75

Post by anigbrowl »

alexhutcheson wrote: post #59
nicoburns wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because most people who study are looking to use their qualification to further their careers, and hiring tends to be very reputation based. It's that demand that would need to change.

If you do 2 years at a community college, then 2 years at University of Maryland, your degree just says “University of Maryland”. There’s no reason to break it out on your resume either. Anecdotally, it seems like the people I know who went the community college route ended up finishing their degrees at more prestigious universities than they would have if they went straight to a 4 year school.

People are reasonably worried about the difficulty of changing schools mid-stream and whether they'll be able to pick up smoothly at the more prestigious school or be at an academic or social disadvantage relative to those who did their whole degree there. Also, these choices are faced primarily by young people who have no college experience and often little life experience in things like fiscal management. Meanwhile students are bombarded endorsements for the idea of being accepted to a prestigious university, whereas announcing that 'you're going to start community college!' is equivalent to signaling that you will be spending two years on an uncompetitive track.

I think it's disingenuous to ignore these differences, or to assume that employers will necessarily take the broader view. I am not asserting that the approach you describe cannot work out very well for some individuals.

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#76

Post by throwawayjava »

tptacek wrote: post #69
throwawayjava wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Where I live in Maryland, you can do two years at the local community college (which is excellent) for $8,000 in tuition and fees, before finishing up at a four year-college. This is true for the majority of students, but not generally true for the top ~1-10% of students who often need all 4 years to compete for slots at top law schools, med schools, phd programs, and employers. And getting into the top 4-5 of any…

That explains why a small elite who likely don't need assistance with loans don't avail themselves of community college, but doesn't say much about the general case.

To reiterate, the question I'm asking is: how many people think they're the small elite but are actually the general case?

I.e., how many people are acting irrationally vs. how many people are misjudging their own place in the world?

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#77

Post by p1necone »

jtbayly wrote: post #54
shmerl wrote: post #9

Instead of collecting debts, they should figure out how to make education free.

Is this meant to be sarcastic? I suppose it would be possible if you enslaved those with PHDs and unpaid debt, forcing them to teach at universities administrated by those enslaved for their debt, built by those enslaved for their debt. Pharaoh had a lot of things for “free,” as did the plantation owners in the US, but the cost of free is pretty much the opposite of free for those who end up doing the paying. And the…

As is true of so many other things in the United States, you just have to look at all the other western countries that manage to handle this just fine. Not all have totally free tertiary education of course, but there's a mix of that, along with interest free loans, partial subsidy by the government etc etc. And many of them work very well.

This kind of myopic skepticism is so tiring.

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#79

Post by larrywright »

anigbrowl wrote: post #73
TallGuyShort wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can't find gainful employment with your new degree, not much worth repossessing, is there?

We teach kids they can be whoever they want to be, then stick them with a massive bill and say 'ha ha only kidding you miserable debt slave.'

The first half of that sentence is the problem, in my opinion. We treat all college degrees as having equal value and offer loans for massive sums of money, with no regard to their likely ability to pay it back. $150k to get a law degree? Ok, that's likely to work out. $150k to get a degree in Russian Literature? Or theatre? That's not a good investment. Of course there are people who have degrees like that and they end up in high paying jobs (often not in the field they studied), but they're the exception to the rule.

We seem to have stopped explaining how supply and demand works. Companies have a demand for employees with certain skills. If you can supply those skills, they will pay you. The higher the demand for those skills, the more they pay (IT, medical, many trades). If you have a skill that nobody has a demand for (say, theatre, or russian literature), you're in trouble.

Of course if you have a degree that isn't in demand, there's a way out. Find a way to take the skills you have and turn them into someone that companies want to pay money for. Turn your english degree into a career in copywriting, or your degree in theatre into a career in... something.

Re: U.S. Stepping Up Enforcement on Delinquent Student Loans

#80

Post by larrywright »

rayiner wrote: post #33

I’m convinced you can’t fix the education problem in the US until you can fix the demand side as well. Where I live in Maryland, you can do two years at the local community college (which is excellent) for $8,000 in tuition and fees (total), before finishing up at a four year-college. Very few people take advantage of the opportunity. Why are people clamoring for free college when they’re not using the cheaper option…

Free college is an awful idea, honestly. That's not going to fix the problem, and will most likely make it significanly worse.
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