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Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

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Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#11

Post by rqs »

greendestiny_re wrote: post #4

I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers. After reeling in enough customers, lab-grown fish produced for profit will inevitably have to deteriorate in quality to maintain/increase revenue. Can this kind of endeavor scale? Can it be introduced to schools, for example? I'm sure some consumers will swallow the idea hook, line and sinker but I see it as just…

> I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers

I'm a futuristic person, I like to imagine what I can do far into the future, something like: "Hey space ship, I like to have some roasted Salmon Sushi sprinkled with tomato paste to be delivered to the observation deck please. Thanks!"

And I believe synthetic food is the first step to archive that.

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#12

Post by Joakal »

taneq wrote: post #5
greendestiny_re wrote: post #4

I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers. After reeling in enough customers, lab-grown fish produced for profit will inevitably have to deteriorate in quality to maintain/increase revenue. Can this kind of endeavor scale? Can it be introduced to schools, for example? I'm sure some consumers will swallow the idea hook, line and sinker but I see it as just…

Well they're not suddenly going to gain in mercury content or anything so I'd expect they'll always have an edge in health. Also, 11/10 with the fishy idioms. :)

Or just have land farms of fish: http://www.uarahfisheries.com.au/

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#13

Post by pvaldes »

Is enough dificult yet by traditional methods.

There is a limit to the tick of a meat piece if oxigen and food must rely in simple difussion. Fishes need omega3 fatty acids to survive. They are unable to synthesize it. How do you effectively feed with omega-3 the cells of an animal without stomach? I wonder also how cell excrection would be solved without a few tubes and filters to collect it. Would you eat fish fillets growing soaked in "fish urine"?

The list of challenges to solve is really long.

The more interesting goal here is changing the perception of public about what is food. There are lots of problems with fish breeding. Bad husbandry practices will produce easily a lot percentage of deformed fishes in the pool (lacking one or two eyes, lack of opercles is also common and skeletal sclerosis can produce "Z" plied fishes easily also). Those are unmarketable today. If you just say that it was cultivated in a laboratory then abismal quality products could suddently enter in a market chain and turn into acceptable or even top quality. Even better than the real thing.

But a good comforting lie is still a lie.

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#15

Post by wpietri »

greendestiny_re wrote: post #4

I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers. After reeling in enough customers, lab-grown fish produced for profit will inevitably have to deteriorate in quality to maintain/increase revenue. Can this kind of endeavor scale? Can it be introduced to schools, for example? I'm sure some consumers will swallow the idea hook, line and sinker but I see it as just…

I don't think it's inevitable that quality has to deteriorate. I buy all sorts of manufactured products that are perfectly good; competition in balanced, well-run markets keeps producers in line.

And personally, I'm willing to pay extra for lab-grown. I'm sure they'll sell that as a health benefit; it's much easier to avoid contaminants. But for me it's about minimized negative externalities. I don't have to worry that I'm driving a species extinct, or contributing to some more localized eco-catastrophe.

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#16

Post by perfmode »

rqs wrote: post #11
greendestiny_re wrote: post #4

I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers. After reeling in enough customers, lab-grown fish produced for profit will inevitably have to deteriorate in quality to maintain/increase revenue. Can this kind of endeavor scale? Can it be introduced to schools, for example? I'm sure some consumers will swallow the idea hook, line and sinker but I see it as just…

> I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers I'm a futuristic person, I like to imagine what I can do far into the future, something like: "Hey space ship, I like to have some roasted Salmon Sushi sprinkled with tomato paste to be delivered to the observation deck please. Thanks!" And I believe synthetic food is the first step to archive that.

do you know why you want such a such thing? is it merely indulgence?

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#17

Post by neltnerb »

siruncledrew wrote: post #3

> BlueNalu is not looking to replace wild-caught or farm-raised seafood, but is aiming to become a third alternative for seafood eaters. Since they are targeting “fish that cannot be easily farmed”, the whiff I get from this idea is akin to synthetic diamonds. This lab grown fish is an alternative to the rare and high-end fish that is harder (and more expensive) to get. This is not a cheap replacement for standard co…

I don't think I follow. If I had the choice of eating a wild bluefin tuna versus lab grown bluefish tuna meat, I'd eat the lab grown meat every time because... overfishing of bluefin tuna is a serious problem.

There is never a silver bullet, but if we can improve stocks of any wild fish via displacement, it's working to save the oceans.

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#18

Post by asciimo »

jacknews wrote: post #6

Indoor fish farming seems like a much more practical approach to solve the problems inherent in catching wild fish to eat (and the pollution that outdoor fish farms cause), and a much more logical next step for seafood than lab-grown muscle tissue. Lab-meat makes most sense for beef, which is an incredibly inefficient and habitat-destroying food source, and is also often served in a processed form anyway, ie as mince…

It is likely more efficient to scale lab-grown fish than it is to scale farmed fish. Cell farming is currently expensive an inefficient, like any new technology. But this can be improved. Yet it will always take at least x energy input to create at most x/10 edible fish output. (https://study.com/academy/lesson/the-10-energy-rule-in-a-foo...)

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#19

Post by NeedMoreTea »

wpietri wrote: post #15
greendestiny_re wrote: post #4

I have a sinking feeling this kind of synthetic food production is just a bait for health-wary consumers. After reeling in enough customers, lab-grown fish produced for profit will inevitably have to deteriorate in quality to maintain/increase revenue. Can this kind of endeavor scale? Can it be introduced to schools, for example? I'm sure some consumers will swallow the idea hook, line and sinker but I see it as just…

I don't think it's inevitable that quality has to deteriorate. I buy all sorts of manufactured products that are perfectly good; competition in balanced, well-run markets keeps producers in line. And personally, I'm willing to pay extra for lab-grown. I'm sure they'll sell that as a health benefit; it's much easier to avoid contaminants. But for me it's about minimized negative externalities. I don't have to worry th…

You may pay extra, plenty might want the same for less - particularly if it becomes fashionable. We don't really have balanced, well run markets, so competition also produces cheap, profitable eco-catastrophes, either to sell a similar product for less - see US experience of beef farming. Or to turn a once wild-caught luxury food into a mass market everyday food - see almost all salmon farming. No problem - the eco-catastrophe is now someone else's problem - an externality.

I see no reason to have confidence this will be any different in terms of eco-damage or other pollution without strengthening regulation in several areas. Just being in a "lab" - which will be regular food factory once commercialised - won't remove waste, or stuff down the drains.

Re: Seafood Without the Sea: Will Lab-Grown Fish Hook Consumers?

#20

Post by intopieces »

What is never brought up in the lab grown meat discussion is the potential to mitigate human suffering. Working a fishing boat is hard. Working a poultry plant is hard and psychologically stressful. Lab grown meat could eliminate that for thousands of people.
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