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On the Trail of the RoboCall King

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Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#51

Post by janj »

yitchelle wrote: post #29
janj wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I answer most robo calls and usually try to call back after I get them to hang up on me. The number is almost never in service. When it is and it leads to the scammer I'll sometimes continue calling and messing with them until my number is blocked by them. I've been messing with spam callers for more than 20 years. I wish more people would answer these calls and waste as much of their time as possible.

Did you just fulfilled for "one ring" scam by calling them back?

I never called back a number unless I had an amusing conversation with someone first

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#52

Post by 0xfeba »

deflector wrote: post #2

I don't understand why the robocalls are a thing. Why are robocalls able to cause such a stir? Why are they referred to as " robocalls " in the first place, when this is such a lowbrow term that it might imply that the victims are part of the problem, due to an inability to adequately cope with something that requires very little effort to deflect. To give them a special name, in and of itself, raises phonecall spam…

Because, like spam email, it only has to work for a tiny fraction of a percentage of targets to be profitable, and enforcement is rare.

Except it's more annoying than spam email because it actively interrupts people.

And since origins are spoofed, I usually can't determine if it's a robocall unless I answer. Especially if you are expecting unknown number calls (selling something, etc.)

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#53

Post by markovbot »

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #47
Ruedii wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Under Obama they made steps forward to stop these, penalties were drastically increased, and an actual investigation team was put together, but Trump defunded the efforts and now the complaint form leads to a massive master in pile with no hope of a single message being read. The phone companies ARE able to stop the caller ID spoofing with a simple notch filter placed at the right point on the line, or packet filter…

The phone companies ARE able to stop the caller ID spoofing with a simple notch filter placed at the right point on the line, or packet filter on the right place on the firewall. T-mobile already does, along with some other magic logic they have stopped almost all of the spam calls from reaching me. ...Occasionally they block my mom for a day or two, but it's worth it.

I have a t-mobile line and a Google voice number, I don't give out the T-Mobile number so 100% of legitimate calls come through Google Voice, but 100% of spam calls come through T-Mobile. Also I'm not sure when you're saying they added this magical filtering but I've tested spoofing calls to myself and other T-Mobile phones within the last few months and it works fine.

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#54

Post by janj »

cafard wrote: post #49
janj wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I answer most robo calls and usually try to call back after I get them to hang up on me. The number is almost never in service. When it is and it leads to the scammer I'll sometimes continue calling and messing with them until my number is blocked by them. I've been messing with spam callers for more than 20 years. I wish more people would answer these calls and waste as much of their time as possible.

I amuse myself by asking the "health insurance" and student loan callers for a number at which I can call them back. This generally causes an immediate disconnection. One guy was naive enough to give me a real number, but I never got around to hassling them. In the days when the calls were for auto warranties, it was "What company do you represent, and in what state is it incorporated?" that caused them to disconnect…

I once had a solicitation for cable so I tried to get the guy to describe in as much detail as he would the porn options.

When I get calls from the home buyer scams I'll get to the point where they ask for my address. I'll make up something like 6843927991 Esplanada Terraced View Way Point Circle and I've never been called on it, they act like something is wrong with the system when they can't find the address.

Sometimes when I call numbers back I'll go right into a spiel asking if they're registered voters who want to see Trump president for life and what monthly support amount can we count on. I find it so amusing when I get responses like "this number can not receive unsolicited calls". I found for some reason people will usually stay on the line if you plow through the conversation, it's like they want to first explain why I shouldn't be calling them before hanging up.

For some reason my favorite name I've come up with for these people is Bobert Robertson. I'll play with them when they ask me to spell it, sometimes it's Bobrot Robyurtzon, the y is silent of course.

I've had people beg me to stop calling them, that I'm disrupting their work day. When you get into it it can be very amusing.

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#55

Post by onetimeusename »

55555 wrote: post #20

Seems to me that the FCC doesn't actually want to stop these. Watch the senate commission deposition(?) of Adrian Abramavich. He says all these calls are routed through 5 or 6 tier-2+ VOIP firms who openly solicit robocall business and then blend the traffic to prevent the most obvious red flags. Just pull their licenses(?). Unless there's more to the story and everyone in the industry is getting rich from this, whic…

No, this is not correct.

There have been several initiatives that the FCC as well as the FTC have done over the past 2 years.

They gave permission to providers to begin blocking unallocated numbers in 2017 which included IRS numbers and this reduced the number of IRS scam calls. Providers are not normally allowed to block calls so rules had to be formulated about when they could block calls like these.

The FCC authorized wireless providers to take measures to block spam text messages in 2018.

By the end of 2019, caller ID authentication is expected to be put in to use. The FCC cannot specify how providers are to implement a caller ID authentication system. An independent task force, the IETF, created an RFC for the STIR[1] and SHAKEN protocols to authenticate a caller's ID. These types of things have to take input from all involved parties and settle on a proposal after reviewing it and agreeing on it. The networks have agreed to implement it within their own networks first, at the behest of the FCC. This kind of system can't be implemented overnight and the FCC is not in a position to specify an implementation and force providers to use it.

In addition there have been a number of prosecutions of companies, like ABC Hispana Inc[2]. However, it is difficult to prosecute offshore providers in noncompliant countries although the FCC is proposing rules to allow it to charge such companies regardless.

[1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/stir/about/

[2] https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/cases-proceedings/152-3108/a...

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#56

Post by m-p-3 »

dewey wrote: post #23
topherPedersen wrote: post #22

Developer of RoboStop here. If anybody here in the comments section happen to use an Android phone and are plagued by telemarketing calls from Indian dev shops offering to build you a website, check out my app! http://robostop.org . It's pretty simple, just hangs up on anyone not listed in your contacts. Very effective. Just make sure to turn it off when you order an Uber. P.S. it's not on the Play Store anymore beca…

Is it just me or does it feel weird to download some random APK from a http site that then has access to my whole call log?

Say thanks to Google for requiring an exemption to access call logs and SMS on the Play Store.

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#57

Post by smhenderson »

stef25 wrote: post #34
topherPedersen wrote: post #22

Developer of RoboStop here. If anybody here in the comments section happen to use an Android phone and are plagued by telemarketing calls from Indian dev shops offering to build you a website, check out my app! http://robostop.org . It's pretty simple, just hangs up on anyone not listed in your contacts. Very effective. Just make sure to turn it off when you order an Uber. P.S. it's not on the Play Store anymore beca…

This morning cops called me to tell me I had 5 min to move my car or it would get towed. When my wife was pregnant the hospital called me to say she'd been admitted after falling in the street. Surely hanging up on anyone not in your contacts is a bad idea?

I would not want that for the same reason. It's not great but I deal with them by 1) generally keeping my phone on silent and 2) only answering calls from people in my contact list. If they really need to reach me they will leave a voice mail, if not then it most likely wasn't important.

I'm not sure a cop would leave a message in the situation you mentioned above but otherwise it works OK. Some of the robo callers end up leaving a message but it's almost always 2 seconds or less so I don't bother listening, anything that short just gets deleted.

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#58

Post by kimi »

imglorp wrote: post #30
kimi wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes they leave a message on the voicemail, and in this case you do have a number to be called back. I wonder if it would be legal for you to recall them using a robodialer. Say you implement something like this: https://www.wombatdialer.com/blog/blog/2017/03/17/outbounds-... this is a reverse IVR, that keeps calling until it gets an explicit acknowledgement. It is cheap to run (you set up a FreePBX somewhere),…

It would need to be paired with something like Jolly Roger, above, which is darn good at spoofing a human for a while. It would need a variety of voices and scripts so the recipient humans wouldn't get trained on it too fast.

You could simply play a message of your voice that says "My number is 555-123-4444 please get me immediately off your list - press 7 to confirm". They will hang up and the dialer will call again. And again.

Re: On the Trail of the RoboCall King

#59

Post by mreider »

Ruedii wrote: post #26
55555 wrote: post #20

Seems to me that the FCC doesn't actually want to stop these. Watch the senate commission deposition(?) of Adrian Abramavich. He says all these calls are routed through 5 or 6 tier-2+ VOIP firms who openly solicit robocall business and then blend the traffic to prevent the most obvious red flags. Just pull their licenses(?). Unless there's more to the story and everyone in the industry is getting rich from this, whic…

Under Obama they made steps forward to stop these, penalties were drastically increased, and an actual investigation team was put together, but Trump defunded the efforts and now the complaint form leads to a massive master in pile with no hope of a single message being read. The phone companies ARE able to stop the caller ID spoofing with a simple notch filter placed at the right point on the line, or packet filter…

There are interesting correlations that lead people to believe the phone companies are doing more than merely enabling these criminals. It seems they are collaborating.

If you drive to a certain location with some level of frequency you will notice the location of the spoofed numbers are in those communities. This goes beyond neighbor spoofing, and suggests some level of information sharing between the robocaller and the phone carrier.

As of January, I started driving to Pleasanton, California every day for work. I also started visiting San Rafael about once month to visit friends who recently moved there.

In the last few months - almost every robocall I get is coming from Pleasanton or San Rafael prefixes.

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