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Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

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431–440 of 467 posts

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe the literature says that compress before encrypt is less secure, because compression behaves predictably. See CRIME attacks.

But, why compress at all then? It won't do anything. I'm not sure this is a good enough reason to never compress anything.

Maybe they encrypt with rot13. Compression should work on such a "ciphertext"...

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand the obsession with small binaries and compiled packages. I care about usability and user experience. If it takes 5mb to have a smooth experience then I’m all for it. It’s funny how we now have fiber having 1GB/s internet speeds and we rant about having 1MB size package being too big. Also, everyone’s moving to 4k now with even bigger transfer/data requirements. tldr; 1mb should be a non issue as lo…

I have gigabit internet and the web is still dog slow. It got a good bit faster when I started blocking third party garbage, but it still doesn't feel any faster than it was in the early 2000's, despite that my internet is literally 17,000 times faster and my computer is also tons faster.

This has also been my experience, uBlock origin improved performance on many websites (and also clues me into how many unnecessary connections by analytics and tracking servers are made by so many sites). It is mind boggling to see sometimes 250+ blocked requests on the badge for a news article.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is flash. You can't do anything in it that fills like the web - no copy paste Whereas you would have that in a Canvas or OpenGL equivalent web game? > right clicking causes things to happen. That's already the case for tons of websites, there's support for that in web standards. > There's a reason why flash died out, and it's not only apple. Yes. It was controlled by a single company, IDEs were paid for, it wa…

> Whereas you would have that in a Canvas or OpenGL equivalent web game? Yes, you would, at least for some parts. Web games often combine the canvas showing the "game world" with DOM showing some UI elements - on which all the usual affordances work. > That's already the case for tons of websites, there's support for that in web standards. Fortunately most sites don't bother. The defaults matter.

Last I checked, web games pretty much died with Flash. Sure, it coincided with mobile games soaring, but I doubt web games would've become this scarce without Flash dying as well.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#434

Can someone from the Google team comment on what's going on - https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/kotlin-is-now-googles-pref... > Android development will become increasingly Kotlin-first,” Google writes in today’s announcement https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/google-launches-jetpack-co... > Google today announced the first preview of Jetpack Compose, a new open-source UI toolkit for Kotlin developers who want to use…

Dart

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#435
post #261

Can someone from the Google team comment on what's going on - https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/kotlin-is-now-googles-pref... > Android development will become increasingly Kotlin-first,” Google writes in today’s announcement https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/google-launches-jetpack-co... > Google today announced the first preview of Jetpack Compose, a new open-source UI toolkit for Kotlin developers who want to use…

If you want to do android development, Kotlin. If you want to do multi platform development, flutter. I think flutter will be an amazing tool for smaller teams, especially in non-tech-primary organisations. I work in the public sector of Denmark, we do in-house development, our main focus is the public services we provide though. So there is just no way we can do mobile, desktop and web without something like Flutter…

I have to correct you.

If you want to do android development, Kotlin

If you want to do multi platform development, Kotlin multi platform

Kotlin mpp is still in beta but it works pretty amazing. I have 1 app in production that shares models/API/database. The UI on Android and iOS is native and platform specific. I highly recommend it.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#436
post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of my mobile phone apps look like any of my other mobile phone apps. I've never really considered it to be a problem. The thing that looks like a play button makes the media start, the square makes the media stop. The speech bubble looking thing makes some sort of conversation happen, and the photo looking icon either opens a camera or lets me add a photo from my camera roll. That last one gets a bit annoying. B…

> The thing that looks like a play button makes the media start, the square makes the media stop. This is an example of following an established convention, much like the conventions of the platform. > But I seriously don't care. So long as every app is consistent with itself. What if every app invented its own symbols for play and stop?

> What if every app invented its own symbols for play and stop?

That'd suck.

But I don't care about the shadows, or lack of, on buttons.

Nor do I care about the exact animation that happens when transitioning between screens.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're sending JavaScript down the line with every request, you're doing it wrong and should give up your career.

When you go to a new website, it doesn't download anything?

NEW website. As in, ONCE and FIRST TIME.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whereas you would have that in a Canvas or OpenGL equivalent web game? Yes, you would, at least for some parts. Web games often combine the canvas showing the "game world" with DOM showing some UI elements - on which all the usual affordances work. > That's already the case for tons of websites, there's support for that in web standards. Fortunately most sites don't bother. The defaults matter.

Last I checked, web games pretty much died with Flash. Sure, it coincided with mobile games soaring, but I doubt web games would've become this scarce without Flash dying as well.

Scarce? There are plenty of them available.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#439
post #127

I love the idea of Flutter for mobile and desktop but I'm very skeptical about the web implementation. They will need to reimplement tons of stuff that are already included in the browsers and ship all that code with the application.

I look at it differently. When someone compiles a game to webassembly it's seen as an accomplishment, right? It doesn't mean you would normally write web apps this way, particularly if you're targeting consumers internationally and need web pages to load fast. But being able to make a desktop or mobile app work in a browser should be useful, particularly for businesses. Sometimes you're not targeting the whole world…

Very well said! Thank you!

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#440

It feels wrong architecturally for Google to be pushing this right now: 1) Dart was intended as a Java like language and is inferior to Kotlin, a language they just endorsed on Android yesterday. Dart feels like a step back, not forward. The message is confusing from Google on this front. They have a huge Kotlin developer community already. Why push Dart at all? 2) World + dog is moving towards compiling Kotlin and m…

If you just look at the languages, Kotlin has a lot of nice features that Dart doesn't currently have. Non-nullable types, extension methods, and data classes are on the top of my mind. If you look at Kotlin and Dart as implementations , then there are differences under the hood. Kotlin is deeply married to the JVM. That has a lot of obvious pros: you can seamlessly interop with your existing Java code, reuse the exi…

Actually Kotlin has a native compiler and (and a js compiler) and I'm not advertising the JVM variant here. The native compiler is also able to target WASM. WASM of course still lacks a garbage collector, which is currently holding back Kotlin (and other languages) there. I believe Google is involved in fixing that. On native they bundle their own garbage collector. I imagine MS is bundling one with Blazor in WASM. As soon as WASM matures (GC, threads, and a few other things) that becomes an obvious path for Flutter as well. Now would be a good time to start working on that. E.g. MS is doing very similar things with C# and Blazor as you are doing with flutter. Except they are doing this with WASM and llvm (check their .net 5.0 announcements a few days ago). I think this is the future proof path for Flutter as well and I question the need for Dart or a separate runtime. IMHO a LLVM based toolchain like on IOS needs to be the default on Android/ChromeOS as well. Something like Flutter paired with Kotlin or Swift could work really well.

I've actually heard of flutter projects doing the business logic in Kotlin and cross compiling that as a library to IOS and Android. The main reason the team cited is that they thought Dart was simply to limited for what they needed; from their point of view it was a necessary evil. It's great that you are trying to fix that. IMHO Typescript and Kotlin are worlds apart (I use both). Typescript is much more limited and way more quirky to deal with.

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