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An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

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Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#21

Post by rayiner »

ohashi wrote: post #19

How unapologetic the prosecutor still is offends me. Trying to use anti fornication laws from 1796 and knowing it's a miscarriage of justice? Yet still thinks it's the right decision.

The laws were on the books, and the public's opposition to what the movie-maker was doing seems to fit in with the intent and scope of the laws. Maybe you can blame him for selective enforcement, but I don't think that qualifies as a miscarriage of justice. (That is, of course, assuming we take at face value that his denial that he didn't steal and ship a copy of the movie to Oklahoma.)

The prosecutor took measures to avoid normalizing what he and the community saw as deviant behaviors. That's one of the key purposes of law: it allows society to express its condemnation of certain conduct.

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#22

Post by JumpCrisscross »

ohashi wrote: post #19

How unapologetic the prosecutor still is offends me. Trying to use anti fornication laws from 1796 and knowing it's a miscarriage of justice? Yet still thinks it's the right decision.

I’m surprised the ACLU or an analogous force didn’t step in to set a precedent to get the law off the books. The interstate trafficking charge might have complicated that. But were there really no liberal First Amendment NGOs in the 70s?

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#23

Post by reallydude »

kgwgk wrote: post #17
Nevermark wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was clearly an amateur since he had never made any kind of movie. But his intent was to make a professional/commercial film. They are not necessarily disjoint concepts. To top that off, at the end of the interview he gives himself a humorous critique suggesting he found his own work failed to make the professional grade.

I wouldn't classify as "amateur" a commercial movie where the lead roles are played by professional actors, but that may be just me. The downvotes I got agree with you. (Being a bad movie may make it look "amateurish", but that's something different.)

> a commercial movie where the lead roles are played by professional actors,

I'm not sure you've gotten anywhere, describing what professional means, when you make it dependent on other entities as an explanation. There are plenty of bad SAG actors. What about just saying "union production"? Although I think that's the minimal bar, there have been non-union successes...which don't look professional to me. eg https://www.reddit.com/r/acting/comments/a59tum/what_are_the...

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#24

Post by balfirevic »

rayiner wrote: post #21
ohashi wrote: post #19

How unapologetic the prosecutor still is offends me. Trying to use anti fornication laws from 1796 and knowing it's a miscarriage of justice? Yet still thinks it's the right decision.

The laws were on the books, and the public's opposition to what the movie-maker was doing seems to fit in with the intent and scope of the laws. Maybe you can blame him for selective enforcement, but I don't think that qualifies as a miscarriage of justice. (That is, of course, assuming we take at face value that his denial that he didn't steal and ship a copy of the movie to Oklahoma.) The prosecutor took measures t…

All of that seems to equally apply to a prosecutor going after runaway slaves and their accomplices at the time when slavery was legal and accepted in community, does it not?

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#25

Post by akvadrako »

vezycash wrote: post #11

Summary: Young man has a passion & dream to make movies. He has a thriving business but it's not enough to fund the movie. His friends agree to fund a movie but with a clause - it must be a porno movie. He researches existing literature and it sucks. He won't make porn. He'll make a real movie that also has explicit sex. He shoots normal scenes first, and sex scenes later. Sex scenes has some issues like the actors u…

Are you implying laws should be ignored after a few years go by?

That’s not how laws work. Many of the laws that our important to daily life are hundreds of years old.

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#26

Post by ouid »

rayiner wrote: post #21
ohashi wrote: post #19

How unapologetic the prosecutor still is offends me. Trying to use anti fornication laws from 1796 and knowing it's a miscarriage of justice? Yet still thinks it's the right decision.

The laws were on the books, and the public's opposition to what the movie-maker was doing seems to fit in with the intent and scope of the laws. Maybe you can blame him for selective enforcement, but I don't think that qualifies as a miscarriage of justice. (That is, of course, assuming we take at face value that his denial that he didn't steal and ship a copy of the movie to Oklahoma.) The prosecutor took measures t…

Selective enforcement is absolutely a miscarriage of justice. Justice is the character of law that makes it fair. If you disagree with this, I would like to hear your defense.

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#27

Post by bradleyjg »

akvadrako wrote: post #25
vezycash wrote: post #11

Summary: Young man has a passion & dream to make movies. He has a thriving business but it's not enough to fund the movie. His friends agree to fund a movie but with a clause - it must be a porno movie. He researches existing literature and it sucks. He won't make porn. He'll make a real movie that also has explicit sex. He shoots normal scenes first, and sex scenes later. Sex scenes has some issues like the actors u…

Are you implying laws should be ignored after a few years go by? That’s not how laws work. Many of the laws that our important to daily life are hundreds of years old.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desuetude

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#28

Post by pawelmurias »

ouid wrote: post #26
rayiner wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The laws were on the books, and the public's opposition to what the movie-maker was doing seems to fit in with the intent and scope of the laws. Maybe you can blame him for selective enforcement, but I don't think that qualifies as a miscarriage of justice. (That is, of course, assuming we take at face value that his denial that he didn't steal and ship a copy of the movie to Oklahoma.) The prosecutor took measures t…

Selective enforcement is absolutely a miscarriage of justice. Justice is the character of law that makes it fair. If you disagree with this, I would like to hear your defense.

The world is an inherently unfair place so it's dubious that laws that attempt to regulate it should be fair.

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#29

Post by madsmith »

akvadrako wrote: post #25
vezycash wrote: post #11

Summary: Young man has a passion & dream to make movies. He has a thriving business but it's not enough to fund the movie. His friends agree to fund a movie but with a clause - it must be a porno movie. He researches existing literature and it sucks. He won't make porn. He'll make a real movie that also has explicit sex. He shoots normal scenes first, and sex scenes later. Sex scenes has some issues like the actors u…

Are you implying laws should be ignored after a few years go by? That’s not how laws work. Many of the laws that our important to daily life are hundreds of years old.

I think that’d be a wonderful thing if all laws had a natural sunset clause and were forced to be renewed to see if they confirm to the standards of the current society.

Private lewdness was one of the charges. Even the prosecutor said that it was all a bit over the top but he had these laws as tools so he used them.

Re: An Amateur Porno Set Off a Federal Witch Hunt

#30

Post by kgwgk »

reallydude wrote: post #23
kgwgk wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't classify as "amateur" a commercial movie where the lead roles are played by professional actors, but that may be just me. The downvotes I got agree with you. (Being a bad movie may make it look "amateurish", but that's something different.)

> a commercial movie where the lead roles are played by professional actors, I'm not sure you've gotten anywhere, describing what professional means, when you make it dependent on other entities as an explanation. There are plenty of bad SAG actors. What about just saying "union production"? Although I think that's the minimal bar, there have been non-union successes...which don't look professional to me. eg https://…

Are you suggesting that films can be classified as either “union” or “amateur”? Star Wars is an amateur film then. And saying “amateur porno” is redundant.
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