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America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

nytimes.com

201–210 of 314 posts

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#201
post #80
post #36

> Because private-equity firms appear frequently as villains in the press, many people assume that they cater mostly to the superrich, earning high returns on investments for billionaire clients. They do. But by far the most important piece of their business — 48 percent, according to the data-analytics firm Preqin — is investing capital for American pension funds. This doesn't get mentioned often enough when talking…

Having been gainfully employed in corporate IT since I was 19 - and doing max contribution to my 401k every year since - I'm not "in touch" with the predicament of today's kids. Are they alright? Record employment numbers today. Wage growth up. We still have a talent shortage. Being (now) a business owner, my biggest complaint on the talent front isn't a lack of education in candidates, it's a lack of customer focus…

This sounds like straight-up textbook Just-World[1] logic to me. You appear to be completely discounting structural and systemic forces against economic mobility for certain members of society.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-world_hypothesis

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a huge disservice to take a cheap shot at 401ks. There is almost no case where someone who has the opportunity to contribute shouldn't do so.

Eh, after fees most standard 401Ks are only marginally better than a bank account at this point.

A 401k wont be invested 100% in cash

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well then our intuition is wrong. If your finances throughout your life are not in order, if you have high debt, regardless if it's because of medical bills, student loans or too big a car and house, you are in a weak position. What good does a nice car do if you worry about bills and if you try to avoid to look at the balance in your banking app? You don't always know how rich some folks are, but for the most part i…

Well, thought experiment: John lives in extreme poverty. He's debt free, but is unable to adequately feed himself or his family. Several of his children have died from malnutrition. Marc lives in a nice suburban home, has 3 square meals a day, so does everyone in his family. However, his debts (including his mortgage, car payments, student loans) exceed his savings. If our intuition is wrong, then John is winning. He…

They’re both screwed. I’d rather have crippling debt than children dying from malnutrition, but obviously both Marc and John are completely screwed in different ways. They’re both losers in this scenario, there are no winners.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>unlikely you'll ever collect from that 401k friend! Like WillPostForFood, I'm baffled about where you're even getting this idea. The 401k is their money. Right now they could withdraw all the money. If their employer goes bankrupt, the 401k balance didn't change at all. The only part that could potentially go away would be unvested company contributions (I'm not sure on this - it's all I can think of though). If we…

I think he's inferring to the government being able to get to it in the future. Whether it be by future legislation of extended early withdrawal penalties, or new tax laws. Yes, it is your money but is still subject to federal and state laws. It's different than a bank account.

Not really that much different with respect to their exposure to future laws; your bank account balance is subject to federal and state laws as well. Yes, future laws could affect your 401(k) balance, but the same holds true for your bank account balance (e.g., wealth taxes, etc..).

But what else can you do, really? Best to put your savings into the most cost effective / tax efficient vehicle that is currently available.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#205
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The top 1% own 40% of the wealth and have realized 95% of the increase in wealth over the past decade: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_inequality_in_the_Unite... "More recently, in 2017, an Oxfam study found that eight rich people, six of them Americans, own as much combined wealth as half the human race."

Both of these things can be true: that the top 1% own a large fraction of wealth, and that an even larger fraction is owned by the pensions and retirement plans of the non-wealthy. Wealth comparisons are tricky, e.g they'll show that Americans are some of the poorest people in the world because there's a large fraction with debt (e.g homes, credit cards, student loans). While technically true, that doesn't really mat…

We see wealth as living in a big house. Not the net value of that house on a balance sheet.

Reality is unimportant. Is perception that matters to society.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's sad. The 870 used to be the AK of shotguns. I beat that that gun like it owed me money and it kept cycling and shooting fine. The 700 used to be weapon of choice for many snipers. Hard to imagine today.

Almost all snipers in the US military today are still using a some Remington 700. The Mk13 which is expected to replace the Marine's scout snipers M40 is 700-pattern, just not built by Remington. You're going to be right soon, just not yet. Likewise, "The Military" is still using Rem 870 and Mossberg 500 shotguns. The "other military" that is, the IRS, Deptartments of Interior, Energy, Education, and everything else;…

They haven't switched to Accuracy International sniper specific rifels - the classic British two guys in a shed company.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a huge disservice to take a cheap shot at 401ks. There is almost no case where someone who has the opportunity to contribute shouldn't do so.

Eh, after fees most standard 401Ks are only marginally better than a bank account at this point.

This is not true at all.

It is very easy to get some sort of vanguard s&p 500 index fund that will get you %7 return rates, with something like .1% fees.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#208
post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, thought experiment: John lives in extreme poverty. He's debt free, but is unable to adequately feed himself or his family. Several of his children have died from malnutrition. Marc lives in a nice suburban home, has 3 square meals a day, so does everyone in his family. However, his debts (including his mortgage, car payments, student loans) exceed his savings. If our intuition is wrong, then John is winning. He…

They’re both screwed. I’d rather have crippling debt than children dying from malnutrition, but obviously both Marc and John are completely screwed in different ways. They’re both losers in this scenario, there are no winners.

Well said.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well then our intuition is wrong. If your finances throughout your life are not in order, if you have high debt, regardless if it's because of medical bills, student loans or too big a car and house, you are in a weak position. What good does a nice car do if you worry about bills and if you try to avoid to look at the balance in your banking app? You don't always know how rich some folks are, but for the most part i…

If you die deep in dept you managed to cheat at life: your cost of living was higher than input. If you die rich you got cheated: you put more effort into life than you got out of it.

That assumes that in some way effort ends up being related to your bank balance.

Re: America’s Oldest Gun Maker Went Bankrupt: A Financial Engineering Mystery

#210
post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, thought experiment: John lives in extreme poverty. He's debt free, but is unable to adequately feed himself or his family. Several of his children have died from malnutrition. Marc lives in a nice suburban home, has 3 square meals a day, so does everyone in his family. However, his debts (including his mortgage, car payments, student loans) exceed his savings. If our intuition is wrong, then John is winning. He…

They’re both screwed. I’d rather have crippling debt than children dying from malnutrition, but obviously both Marc and John are completely screwed in different ways. They’re both losers in this scenario, there are no winners.

That doesn't seem even remotely true. Taking on large amounts of debt can be risky in many cases. But consider the following case:

- newly purchased $150k home with down-payment of $30k

- $80k savings / investments

- $20k car

- $80k/yr income

This person is not at risk, but they have a net worth of $[30k + 80k +20k - 150k] = $-20k

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