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JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

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Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#41

Post by mentat »

sushisource wrote: post #32
ssss11 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's also always been pretty normal to have your photo taken by countries when passing through passport control. No not always, only recently. > I don't really see what the problem would be here? You’re kidding right? There’s multiple privacy problems. Sounds like you either benefit from mass surveillance or have been conditioned to it.

I think being conditioned to it is inevitable to some degree. I think the only reasonable choice is to focus on punishment for misuse, not prevention. This reeks to me of another situation where we're trying to put the cat back in the bag, and that has basically never worked (except maybe nuclear disarmament, and even then... barely, and largely because the capital costs are so extreme). Surveillance tech is cheap an…

Make it symmetric, use it to watch the watchers, then we might be talking about something socially viable. Without that, it's about control.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#42

Post by rmrfrmrf »

Waterluvian wrote: post #35
ssss11 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's also always been pretty normal to have your photo taken by countries when passing through passport control. No not always, only recently. > I don't really see what the problem would be here? You’re kidding right? There’s multiple privacy problems. Sounds like you either benefit from mass surveillance or have been conditioned to it.

In my opinion it's a really bad idea to foster an attitude of, "if you're not with us then you're against us." Some people don't mind these kinds of surveillance. You might staunchly disagree but you have to accept that it's a valid position.

Why do you think that?

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#43

Post by jacklewis »

Here in Australia we have automated passport control gates that scan a chip in our passport then takes a photo of our face (and I assume does some matching with our passport photo) before allowing reentry. It's quite quick and very convenient. Although I'm not aware of any airlines being able to use the system for boarding.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#44

Post by dzhiurgis »

apcragg wrote: post #21

Privacy concerns aside, I can't wait to read the "Facial Recognition let me on the wrong flight when I got in the wrong line by accident" articles that are going to come out of this. Unless these systems have some fantastic (1e-6) P_{false alarm} rate or better, people are going to be mistaken for other people and let on the wrong flight sooner or later.

You need at least 2 people for this mixup to happen...

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#45

Post by shkkmo »

mentat wrote: post #41
sushisource wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think being conditioned to it is inevitable to some degree. I think the only reasonable choice is to focus on punishment for misuse, not prevention. This reeks to me of another situation where we're trying to put the cat back in the bag, and that has basically never worked (except maybe nuclear disarmament, and even then... barely, and largely because the capital costs are so extreme). Surveillance tech is cheap an…

Make it symmetric, use it to watch the watchers, then we might be talking about something socially viable. Without that, it's about control.

There is a fundamental trade-off between transparency and privacy, but also a very real risk that we will end up with neither.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#46

Post by gumby »

chatmasta wrote: post #18
crazygringo wrote: post #9

Most relevant details, from the last link [1]: > It took her photo, comparing her picture to a preloaded photo databased of all the passengers with tickets on this flight, and then she got a check mark, indicating she was cleared to board. The whole process took about five to six seconds. > The Aruba experiment is expected to last somewhere between 45 and 90 days. > "We're basically capturing that picture at the boar…

Is it really that useful to identify someone who has overstayed their visa when they are leaving the country ? Sure, you then know not to let them in next time. But it seems like a lot of effort when there are so many people overstaying their visa and not leaving out of the airports. That said, even as a libertarian, privacy-conscious person, I'm not sure I have a problem with exit controls like this. It's important…

> It's important to know who is crossing the border, in both directions.

Why?

And if there exists an important reason to know that someone is exiting the country does that same criterion not also apply to exiting a state or city or neighborhood?

I am not being sarcastic; I am genuinely unable to come up with a reason it's important to track who leaves almost any place, except in highly unusual cases (e.g. "OK guys, chatmasta has gone; let's get to work planning the surprise party for when he gets back")

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#47

Post by gumby »

dillonmckay wrote: post #33
village-idiot wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, you need photo ID to fly and pass customs.

You don’t need photo ID to fly. TSA will ask you questions from your credit report and allow you to board. *US citizens flying within the states.

You are correct; sad that most people don't know this.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#49

Post by lucisferre »

What is tiring me out about all this "technology improvement" in airport check-in is how confusing it is and how often it changes.

There is no one clear process anymore.

Last week I went to board a flight and checked in using the phone app. At the airport I needed to get a baggage ticket so I used the machine there for that, but it basically had me go through the whole check-in all over again. On top of that the first machine errored during the step to pay the baggage fee so I ended up doing that again with another machine.

Afterwards I went to drop off my bag and was told the tag was not "active" and I'd have to go to the desk.

What the hell is the point of any of these electronic options if at the end of it all I still have to wait in line for an agent, stand there while they "mmm-hmmm" at their computer and avoid eye-contact with me for 5 minutes just to finally scan the tag I had printed and attached myself?

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#50

Post by davrosthedalek »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #44
apcragg wrote: post #21

Privacy concerns aside, I can't wait to read the "Facial Recognition let me on the wrong flight when I got in the wrong line by accident" articles that are going to come out of this. Unless these systems have some fantastic (1e-6) P_{false alarm} rate or better, people are going to be mistaken for other people and let on the wrong flight sooner or later.

You need at least 2 people for this mixup to happen...

Well, you have to hit a no-show. Gives you maybe another two order of magnitude. And the article might be written even if the misidentification was resolved before the flight leaves.
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