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JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

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Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#31

Post by ssss11 »

crazygringo wrote: post #9

Most relevant details, from the last link [1]: > It took her photo, comparing her picture to a preloaded photo databased of all the passengers with tickets on this flight, and then she got a check mark, indicating she was cleared to board. The whole process took about five to six seconds. > The Aruba experiment is expected to last somewhere between 45 and 90 days. > "We're basically capturing that picture at the boar…

>It's also always been pretty normal to have your photo taken by countries when passing through passport control.

No not always, only recently.

> I don't really see what the problem would be here?

You’re kidding right? There’s multiple privacy problems. Sounds like you either benefit from mass surveillance or have been conditioned to it.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#32

Post by sushisource »

ssss11 wrote: post #31
crazygringo wrote: post #9

Most relevant details, from the last link [1]: > It took her photo, comparing her picture to a preloaded photo databased of all the passengers with tickets on this flight, and then she got a check mark, indicating she was cleared to board. The whole process took about five to six seconds. > The Aruba experiment is expected to last somewhere between 45 and 90 days. > "We're basically capturing that picture at the boar…

>It's also always been pretty normal to have your photo taken by countries when passing through passport control. No not always, only recently. > I don't really see what the problem would be here? You’re kidding right? There’s multiple privacy problems. Sounds like you either benefit from mass surveillance or have been conditioned to it.

I think being conditioned to it is inevitable to some degree. I think the only reasonable choice is to focus on punishment for misuse, not prevention.

This reeks to me of another situation where we're trying to put the cat back in the bag, and that has basically never worked (except maybe nuclear disarmament, and even then... barely, and largely because the capital costs are so extreme).

Surveillance tech is cheap and widely available and will only continue to move in that direction. Attempting to make sure no one has a photo of you without your consent seems hilariously impossible to me. Focus on the outcomes instead.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#33

Post by dillonmckay »

village-idiot wrote: post #29
chatmasta wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really that useful to identify someone who has overstayed their visa when they are leaving the country ? Sure, you then know not to let them in next time. But it seems like a lot of effort when there are so many people overstaying their visa and not leaving out of the airports. That said, even as a libertarian, privacy-conscious person, I'm not sure I have a problem with exit controls like this. It's important…

Also, you need photo ID to fly and pass customs.

You don’t need photo ID to fly. TSA will ask you questions from your credit report and allow you to board.

*US citizens flying within the states.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#35

Post by Waterluvian »

ssss11 wrote: post #31
crazygringo wrote: post #9

Most relevant details, from the last link [1]: > It took her photo, comparing her picture to a preloaded photo databased of all the passengers with tickets on this flight, and then she got a check mark, indicating she was cleared to board. The whole process took about five to six seconds. > The Aruba experiment is expected to last somewhere between 45 and 90 days. > "We're basically capturing that picture at the boar…

>It's also always been pretty normal to have your photo taken by countries when passing through passport control. No not always, only recently. > I don't really see what the problem would be here? You’re kidding right? There’s multiple privacy problems. Sounds like you either benefit from mass surveillance or have been conditioned to it.

In my opinion it's a really bad idea to foster an attitude of, "if you're not with us then you're against us."

Some people don't mind these kinds of surveillance. You might staunchly disagree but you have to accept that it's a valid position.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#36

Post by jrockway »

iNate2000 wrote: post #24
GordonS wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if they don't retain the images, it's a veritable treasure trove for security agencies, who will almost certainly be hoovering them up, either with or without the company's knowledge.

It's been a few years since I traveled international - but CBP already takes pictures at passport control, don't they?

I have never had my picture taken while leaving the United States, which is what this sounds like. Arriving? Sure.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#37

Post by chatmasta »

freeone3000 wrote: post #30
chatmasta wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really that useful to identify someone who has overstayed their visa when they are leaving the country ? Sure, you then know not to let them in next time. But it seems like a lot of effort when there are so many people overstaying their visa and not leaving out of the airports. That said, even as a libertarian, privacy-conscious person, I'm not sure I have a problem with exit controls like this. It's important…

Address isn't on the ticket or on the visa/passport. As many people on the "no-fly list" can attest, very many people have the same name.

That's true. But the article is talking about international flights. So in fact they have way more information in this case, as a passport is required. Granted it might not be the same passport the person arrived with. But it's a passport.

Anyway, I think facial recognition makes sense from a security perspective, as an additional layer of defense. You can make assumptions about what faces you expect to see from the passports that are scheduled to fly. If you see an unknown face in the boarding area, it's reasonable to flag that person for further review.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#38

Post by kruegel »

ProAm wrote: post #7
resoluteteeth wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure? According to what the airline said, the airline doesn't have the facial recognition data; rather they are just taking photos from passengers who opt in to board via this method, and the photos only need to be stored for a few seconds so they can be sent to DHS for verification. The airline isn't taking or storing photos of passengers who don't opt into this process, but it is presumably sending the gove…

> According to what the airline said, the airline doesn't have the facial recognition data I absolutely do not believe the tweets from a company PR representative as to how their technology actually works.

Regardless of whether this PR person knows anything or not, I think the much more likely scenario is that they are sending facial recognition requests to a CBP API vs. building their own facial recognition database with 100s of millions of identities out of thin air.

Re: JetBlue explains to a passenger how it got a photo of her face

#39

Post by mikeash »

chatmasta wrote: post #18
crazygringo wrote: post #9

Most relevant details, from the last link [1]: > It took her photo, comparing her picture to a preloaded photo databased of all the passengers with tickets on this flight, and then she got a check mark, indicating she was cleared to board. The whole process took about five to six seconds. > The Aruba experiment is expected to last somewhere between 45 and 90 days. > "We're basically capturing that picture at the boar…

Is it really that useful to identify someone who has overstayed their visa when they are leaving the country ? Sure, you then know not to let them in next time. But it seems like a lot of effort when there are so many people overstaying their visa and not leaving out of the airports. That said, even as a libertarian, privacy-conscious person, I'm not sure I have a problem with exit controls like this. It's important…

It’s not about catching visa overstays on their way out. It’s about identifying who’s still here. Take the set of people who entered, subtract the set who exited, and anyone who remains who entered too long ago is an overstay.
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