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Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

japantimes.co.jp

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Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#21

Post by ekianjo »

socksindrawers wrote: post #16
sandworm101 wrote: post #5

I don't see the problem. Extended detention and repeated interrogation is normal around the world. Visit Rikers island and look at how long people are held there prior to trial (years). The focus on confessions isn't a Japanese thing. Look at how many americans/canadians/brits/auzzis agree plea deals, a form of confession. Repeated questioning isn't torture. In the USA it is true that police have to stop asking quest…

If anything, I'm happy that there's a country willing to prosecute people for white collar crimes. Just look at how America is all-too-willing to let mass murderers like the Sackler family get away with profiting off of addiction. Do these sound like words of someone trying to do anything other than profit off of death? “The prescription blizzard will be so deep, dense, and white.” Meanwhile you see blue collar Ameri…

> If anything, I'm happy that there's a country willing to prosecute people for white collar crimes.

Interesting but Japan almost never jails politicians who are by far more often guilty of stealing/using for their private purposes taxpayers money. They just get a slap on the wrist and they are good to go - no jail sentence, no crime. Amazing isn't it?

Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#22

Post by socksindrawers »

colejohnson66 wrote: post #20
socksindrawers wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anything, I'm happy that there's a country willing to prosecute people for white collar crimes. Just look at how America is all-too-willing to let mass murderers like the Sackler family get away with profiting off of addiction. Do these sound like words of someone trying to do anything other than profit off of death? “The prescription blizzard will be so deep, dense, and white.” Meanwhile you see blue collar Ameri…

Rioting, even with a permit to protest, is illegal

They didn't riot, they were attacked and defended themselves. Look at any video from the event.

Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#23

Post by [deleted] »

ConcernedCoder wrote: post #17
sandworm101 wrote: post #5

I don't see the problem. Extended detention and repeated interrogation is normal around the world. Visit Rikers island and look at how long people are held there prior to trial (years). The focus on confessions isn't a Japanese thing. Look at how many americans/canadians/brits/auzzis agree plea deals, a form of confession. Repeated questioning isn't torture. In the USA it is true that police have to stop asking quest…

My unpopular opinion: Questioning someone longer than they want to provide answers, when that same person is unable to leave the interview is a form of torture -- change my mind.

[deleted]

Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#24

Post by dalore »

sandworm101 wrote: post #5

I don't see the problem. Extended detention and repeated interrogation is normal around the world. Visit Rikers island and look at how long people are held there prior to trial (years). The focus on confessions isn't a Japanese thing. Look at how many americans/canadians/brits/auzzis agree plea deals, a form of confession. Repeated questioning isn't torture. In the USA it is true that police have to stop asking quest…

You can't leave until you confess or payup isn't a problem? With no access to family OR legal representation throughout the process?

Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#25

Post by socksindrawers »

ekianjo wrote: post #21
socksindrawers wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anything, I'm happy that there's a country willing to prosecute people for white collar crimes. Just look at how America is all-too-willing to let mass murderers like the Sackler family get away with profiting off of addiction. Do these sound like words of someone trying to do anything other than profit off of death? “The prescription blizzard will be so deep, dense, and white.” Meanwhile you see blue collar Ameri…

> If anything, I'm happy that there's a country willing to prosecute people for white collar crimes. Interesting but Japan almost never jails politicians who are by far more often guilty of stealing/using for their private purposes taxpayers money. They just get a slap on the wrist and they are good to go - no jail sentence, no crime. Amazing isn't it?

A politician anywhere who doesn't wet their beak at least a little bit is rare. Pay-for-play is the name of the game in the US Congress, they just have the power to have their shenanigans avoid the headlines, except in rare cases.

Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#28

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

ConcernedCoder wrote: post #17
sandworm101 wrote: post #5

I don't see the problem. Extended detention and repeated interrogation is normal around the world. Visit Rikers island and look at how long people are held there prior to trial (years). The focus on confessions isn't a Japanese thing. Look at how many americans/canadians/brits/auzzis agree plea deals, a form of confession. Repeated questioning isn't torture. In the USA it is true that police have to stop asking quest…

My unpopular opinion: Questioning someone longer than they want to provide answers, when that same person is unable to leave the interview is a form of torture -- change my mind.

Under that reasoning I don't see how any form of detainment could not be considered torture as well, including pretty much all public education. One must accept that the real world is not made of lines that provide convenient barriers between concepts, in other words, there are degrees of torture, and some will be much more acceptable than others.

Re: Examining Carlos Ghosn and Japan's System of 'Hostage Justice'

#29

Post by rmah »

ConcernedCoder wrote: post #17
sandworm101 wrote: post #5

I don't see the problem. Extended detention and repeated interrogation is normal around the world. Visit Rikers island and look at how long people are held there prior to trial (years). The focus on confessions isn't a Japanese thing. Look at how many americans/canadians/brits/auzzis agree plea deals, a form of confession. Repeated questioning isn't torture. In the USA it is true that police have to stop asking quest…

My unpopular opinion: Questioning someone longer than they want to provide answers, when that same person is unable to leave the interview is a form of torture -- change my mind.

Your request is, at its heart, a question about the definition of the word "torture".

The pedestrian definition of "torture" as per the Merriam-Webster dictionary is:

1: the infliction of intense pain (as from burning, crushing, or wounding) to punish, coerce, or afford sadistic pleasure

2: a) something that causes agony or pain; b) anguish of body or mind

3: distortion or overrefinement of a meaning or an argument

I guess definition 2b in the context of "mind" fits best with your proposition. Which then leads to the definition of "anguish".

Alternatively, we can examine the legal definition, which will vary by jurisdiction, but for completeness, I will link to the UN definition at https://www.apt.ch/en/what-is-torture/. In brief:

"Torture means any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession"

Here, you'd have to ask if prolonged unwanted questioning causes "severe [mental] pain or suffering".

And finally, perhaps you mean torture in the figurative sense.

Either way, if simply questioning someone "longer than they want" is "torture" then pretty much all of us have, at some point tortured someone. At that point, the word "torture" becomes synonymous with "discomfort" or "to annoy" and would, IMO, lose all utility from a legal point of view.

In the final analysis, what this boils down to is that the world does not exist to serve your desires. Unpleasant things can and will happen to you. Even being asked questions you don't want to answer in situations where you cannot leave. While an individual may never have experienced anything more unpleasant than that, and thus it feels horrible to them, the fact is that there are far far FAR more unpleasant experiences that millions of others have faced. Society does not owe the sheltered more than the less sheltered.

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