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This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

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21–30 of 125 posts

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#21

No it's just a place where you can find enough Plutonium to destroy your enemies or enough U238 to run your civilization for 1000 years... I used to dream that maybe 2500 years from now the Scientologists and the Mormons would fight it out over Yucca mountain but now it's clear the Scientologists won't last that long.

Ha! That would make a great story. Mormons already have a hollowed out mountain[1] but at least ostensibly it's full of genealogical records not plutonium. (Also I'm a Mormon.)

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granite_Mountain_(Utah)

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#23

I feel like there's something to think about here since we couldn't even keep the page with this information active for a decade and the goal is to keep the actual warning around for 10,000 years.

Or, to realize that we did in fact keep it active, just through archive.org, the modern day Library of Alexandria on steroids.

EDIT: Makes things hard if the warning sign was a link however, yes. Could just add a published date then, and I'd assume things would be fine.

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#24
> "Rubble Landscape": A square outer rim of the caliche layer of stone is dynamited and bulldozed into a crude square pile over the entire Keep. This makes a rubble-stone landscape at a level above the surrounding desert, an anomaly both topographic and in roughness of material. The outer rim from which rubble was pushed inward fills with sand, becoming a soft moat, probably with an anomalous pattern of vegetation. This all makes for an enormous landscape of large-stone rubble, one that is very inhospitable, being hard to walk on and difficult to bring machinery onto. It is a place that feels destroyed, rather than one that has been made.

"Landscape of large-stone rubble" describes, among other things, New England, where all of those stone boulders were carefully (or more often carelessly) stacked into stone walls to more-or-less clear the fields for planting or pasturage.

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should create something like the olympiad to gather together and re-tell the epic story of danger every few years, rather than building a monument and hoping it still means something on its own.

Except that won't work in this case. This project was designed to outlive cultures due to the timeframes before radioactive waste becomes safe.

or define the cultures ;)

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#26

No it's just a place where you can find enough Plutonium to destroy your enemies or enough U238 to run your civilization for 1000 years... I used to dream that maybe 2500 years from now the Scientologists and the Mormons would fight it out over Yucca mountain but now it's clear the Scientologists won't last that long.

Ha! That would make a great story. Mormons already have a hollowed out mountain[1] but at least ostensibly it's full of genealogical records not plutonium. (Also I'm a Mormon.) [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granite_Mountain_(Utah)

Why so much work into storing genealogical records?

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#28

I feel like there's something to think about here since we couldn't even keep the page with this information active for a decade and the goal is to keep the actual warning around for 10,000 years.

Or, to realize that we did in fact keep it active, just through archive.org, the modern day Library of Alexandria on steroids. EDIT: Makes things hard if the warning sign was a link however, yes. Could just add a published date then, and I'd assume things would be fine.

This is a nice little script.

    function wayback_link(url) {
      return `https://web.archive.org/web/${url}`;
    }

    console.log(wayback_link("https://github.com"))

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#29

Repeating my comment from the last discussion: This whole thing is an offshoot of antinuclear FUD. If civilization collapses to the point where people no longer realize that radiation is dangerous, then so many people have already died that a few more people dying early from radiation is just background noise. In addition, knowing human nature and our propensity for conspiracy theories, there will be people in the fu…

> In addition, knowing human nature and our propensity for conspiracy theories, there will be people in the future who think all those signs were put there to dissuade people from finding a massive buried treasure. After all, the phrasing is pretty much what you would expect if someone had buried a treasure and wanted to scare people from digging for it. I have to agree with this. What if in 1955 America we had disco…

And, ironically, the discovery of high-energy rock would probably be a celebrated scientific (or at least religious) advance for such a civilisation. Marie Curie's exploits aren't remembered as foolish. She likely died of radiation overexposure and is remembered as one of the heros of science. And many in her lab if I recall correctly.

The 10,000 year warning is an interesting thought experiment, but if there is anyone who claims it is relevant to the acceptance of nuclear power they are simply not very imaginative about all the things that can go wrong over 10,000 years. A civilisation-level mind blank on where the garbage dump is doesn't rate at any meaningful level.

The half life of lead is 1.53×10^7 years. It is a nasty toxic substance; it has killed people. We still use it. It is objectively a bigger threat on a longer time scale than nuclear waste. As usual, nuclear power is special because we could conceivably manage the damage. Most industrial processes cause damage at a scale so large the cost of a no-harm policy would be prohibitive. With nuclear the cost is simply a bit high.

Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, to realize that we did in fact keep it active, just through archive.org, the modern day Library of Alexandria on steroids. EDIT: Makes things hard if the warning sign was a link however, yes. Could just add a published date then, and I'd assume things would be fine.

This is a nice little script. function wayback_link(url) { return `https://web.archive.org/web/${url}`; } console.log(wayback_link("https://github.com"))

I just went to https://web.archive.org/web/news.ycombinator.com (no date in the url) and it sent me to the most recent snapshot.
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