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Can Uber ever make money?

economist.com

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Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#141

Post by bluGill »

dcolkitt wrote: post #32
govg wrote: post #17

I can only see them making money in three ways : - They scale up massively and capture a huge fraction of the ride sharing market, thus allowing them to offer low cost / low margin rides, but making up for it by volumes : At least in India, they are in a good position, but they seem to have conceded the other markets with high potential for growth like SE Asia and China. - They have a premium offering that is actuall…

Option 4: Uber uses the expertise, infrastructure, and brand it built in ridesharing to expand into the becoming the de facto standard for timely last mile delivery. This is why UberEats is such a major strategic focus for the company. It's proof of concept that they can do more than be a taxi. An efficient platform for quickly and cheaply ferrying around stuff around town is a way bigger market than ridesharing. We'…

Courier services have existed for years for last mile.

I have a friend who was (20 years ago) paid full time by one law office to get papers to/from the court room (he worked for a company that dedicated him to that job). Part of his job was knowing the proper way to walk into a trial in progress.

My dad more than once hired a taxi to take a package to the airport. I suspect post 9-11 this isn't legally allowed, but back then if you needed to get a bug fix to a customer your fastest option was put it on a tape, put the tape in a suitcase, buy a plane ticket for "Mr Package", and then check the suitcase in the name of Mr Package.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#142

Post by parksy »

rubicon33 wrote: post #97
Skunkleton wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As it stands the price you pay for a ride in an uber is unfairly low. Driving it even lower would be irresponsible.

Call me a snob, but Uber's criteria for what qualifies as an acceptable car has dramatically declined to the point where even Taxis are sometimes "nicer". Combine that with the fact that the drivers often don't know the neighborhood and rely exclusively on GPS (so tend to be worse drivers than a taxi). I'm left feeling like the fare - strictly from the perspective of a consumer - is actually too high.

Yeah an uber that smells of farts, vomit and piss, and the seats are sticky... that has become more commonplace for standard uber.

Uberx is much nicer for an extra dollar or two (for standard trips), no more farty taxis.

But using my power of recollection - taxis were a crapshoot before uber came along too. Some were okay, some were disgusting.

I have not had (after a night out at a comedy lounge with my wife) an uber driver chase me into another uber, try and yank open the door yelling "I was first in line! You fuck! You Fuck! Get out!" while my taxi driver speeds away tires squealing.

Since uber came along, the quality of standard taxis here in Perth has increased dramatically. The result is a net positive.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#143

Post by basementcat »

temp99990 wrote: post #126

I would love an all you can ride monthly subscription. I know Uber/Lyft have done limited trials but nothing truly an unlimited subscription.

I would totally Moviepass the crap out of this. Road trips across Utah and the Colorado Rockies, Pacific Coast Highway, etc.

Amtrak used to have a similar pass arrangement.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#144

Post by losteric »

Traster wrote: post #98
JimboOmega wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question (with Uber in particular) is that if this business model really covers up a huge ponzi scheme. Before the last decade (or even 5 years?) the amount of money some of these companies have been raising would have been unheard of and required an IPO. But if you can keep finding ever bigger investors to give you ever more money... It's a really weird reality, because typically the worst kind of place to start…

I think that's a really interesting concept. People think Uber will reach a scale where either it can use automation to reduce costs or jack up prices. It may well be the other way around - as it matures regulations catch up and the loopholes it was using to keep costs down disappear and their costs slowly increase instead.

Or that terrible customer experiences which are currently "exceptions to the rule" end up becoming the norm at whatever they pay drivers/charge customers... there are only so many good drivers and customers/contractors burned by bad experiences will not come back to Uber's platform.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#145

Post by rubicon33 »

cbhl wrote: post #136
rubicon33 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Call me a snob, but Uber's criteria for what qualifies as an acceptable car has dramatically declined to the point where even Taxis are sometimes "nicer". Combine that with the fact that the drivers often don't know the neighborhood and rely exclusively on GPS (so tend to be worse drivers than a taxi). I'm left feeling like the fare - strictly from the perspective of a consumer - is actually too high.

What are your thoughts on Uber Select / Uber Black / Lyft Lux / Lyft Lux Black?

Definitely a fan of the Select and Black options. In fact, I've been using them more and more.

The price - while higher - feels more aligned with what I would consider to be "good value".

Ranked in order of importance for me are: - A competent + safe driver, preferably someone who knows the area. - A nice, clean, comfortable ride. - A driver who doesn't talk to me.

All 3 of these are markedly improved in both the Select and Black options. Given I don't take Uber that often, I can justify the expense. If it was something I relied upon on a more regular basis I just don't think I could justify using Select/Black.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#146

Post by an_account_name »

jameslevy wrote: post #106
Traster wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a really interesting concept. People think Uber will reach a scale where either it can use automation to reduce costs or jack up prices. It may well be the other way around - as it matures regulations catch up and the loopholes it was using to keep costs down disappear and their costs slowly increase instead.

Places like NYC already show this in practice.

Can you elaborate? I don't have any context on this other than taking a Lyft in NYC once.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#147

Post by rubicon33 »

parksy wrote: post #142
rubicon33 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Call me a snob, but Uber's criteria for what qualifies as an acceptable car has dramatically declined to the point where even Taxis are sometimes "nicer". Combine that with the fact that the drivers often don't know the neighborhood and rely exclusively on GPS (so tend to be worse drivers than a taxi). I'm left feeling like the fare - strictly from the perspective of a consumer - is actually too high.

Yeah an uber that smells of farts, vomit and piss, and the seats are sticky... that has become more commonplace for standard uber. Uberx is much nicer for an extra dollar or two (for standard trips), no more farty taxis. But using my power of recollection - taxis were a crapshoot before uber came along too. Some were okay, some were disgusting. I have not had (after a night out at a comedy lounge with my wife) an ube…

Totally agree that in the past Taxis were MUCH more of a crapshoot, but lately they've really stepped their game up, which I think is attributable to Uber/Lyft.

So all in all, I think it's been a net positive for the consumer.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#148

Post by chriselles »

It’s so very hard to find any ride share profit Signal within all the Noise of monetary policy and VC weaponisation of capital.

Airlines at least have the possibility of temporarily defending margins on city pairs with mismatched supply/demand.

Perhaps surge pricing on ride share is an analog to that.

The accumulated debts of ride share players seems akin to picking up pennies on ground getting stickier and the steamrollers are accelerating.

It will be interesting to see what happens if/when full spectrum subscription ride share options become available.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#149

Post by schnable »

dcolkitt wrote: post #26
TruthSHIFT wrote: post #7

Keep in mind that this may not change when driverless cars become widely available. Maintaining a fleet thousands of driverless cars may prove to be more expensive than crowdsourcing a vehicle fleet.

There's either two possibilities for the self-driving future. 1) Hardly anybody owns cars anymore. When we want to get from point A to point B, we just call a driverless car from the network. But this type of service is a natural monopoly. When people are ridesharing everywhere, the network with the biggest fleet, becomes the stochastically fastest and cheapest option. Plus add in the fact that they're collecting a l…

Not following how this is a natural monopoly. There aren't barriers to multiple companies operating large fleets.

Re: Can Uber ever make money?

#150

Post by napier »

losteric wrote: post #144
Traster wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a really interesting concept. People think Uber will reach a scale where either it can use automation to reduce costs or jack up prices. It may well be the other way around - as it matures regulations catch up and the loopholes it was using to keep costs down disappear and their costs slowly increase instead.

Or that terrible customer experiences which are currently "exceptions to the rule" end up becoming the norm at whatever they pay drivers/charge customers... there are only so many good drivers and customers/contractors burned by bad experiences will not come back to Uber's platform.

See how well Gojek and Grab are eating Uber's lunch across Asia. Better experience and lower costs.
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