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The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

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Re: The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

#31

Post by gpm »

loco5niner wrote: post #30
gpm wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flying drones close to a fire seems like a counter productive idea, flight is achieved by pushing lots of air around, pushing lots of air around increases the amount of oxygen available to the fire. Edit: Oops - not flying - so this comment makes no sense. I thought you meant some of the bird-like drones we've seen.

That logic seems like a bit of a stretch to me. Following that logic, the best way to fight a fire is to get a lot of people in the building to breathe in all the oxygen and turn it into carbon dioxide ;-)

Humans aren't very good O2->CO2 convertors, and people object to you killing them in the process of fighting fires, so it's not "the best way" but I suppose it is a "way".

A more extreme version, using explosives to put out oil well fires, is common.

But we're really discussing the inverse prospect, adding oxygen to make a fire hotter. This is even more common. From blowing on camp fires, to bellows in a forge, to back yard foundries built with a hair dryer acting as a fan.

Re: The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

#32

Post by gpm »

Notorious_BLT wrote: post #27
gpm wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flying drones close to a fire seems like a counter productive idea, flight is achieved by pushing lots of air around, pushing lots of air around increases the amount of oxygen available to the fire. Edit: Oops - not flying - so this comment makes no sense. I thought you meant some of the bird-like drones we've seen.

The bird-like Boston Dynamics bots aren't flying drones, they are more like ostriches in shape, and they balance on two wheels on legs with a neck-like arm for manipulating things

You're right... oops. Sorry.

Re: The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

#33

Post by athenot »

blancheneige wrote: post #22
melkiaur wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently, a significant difference between American and French firefighters is that the latter prefer to fight the fire from the inside (e.g.: avoid the heat and steam to accumulate inside). Apart from the video aspect, wouldn't the Colossus' water stream help them achieve that: creating a path for them to intervene and potentially escape ?

I was just reading in Le Monde yesterday that this approach is used on historical buildings as working inward would trap the fire and essentially create a localized furnace that would damage the artifacts inside.

Also, the furnace could compromise the stone structure. So the focus was to keep the wall from getting too hot, first from the inside.

Re: The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

#34

Post by stcredzero »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #15
stcredzero wrote: post #2

My awareness comes from a tragic event, but I still must say that the Colossus is pretty cool. I wonder if the birdlike Boston Dynamics robot could be adapted for indoor firefighting in confined spaces. (Perhaps with a flippable/rotatable 4 wheeled gimbal like the Dean Kamen iBot has, which would enable stair climbing.) https://gizmodo.com/boston-dynamics-new-robot-is-a-giant-seg...

I'm not sure the Boston bird can take any significant amount of heat or water, to say nothing of its ability to navigate a floor strewn with (burning) debris.

I'm not sure the Boston bird can take any significant amount of heat or water

If you take an architecture developed for warehouse running, you'd naturally have to adapt it for fire fighting. If you're not assuming that this sort of re-engineering needs to be done for a shirtsleeves R&D device being applied to the demanding context of fire fighting, then please think 1 or 2 more steps ahead when engineering.

In short: I'm trying to talk about some specific modifications to an existing example and its effect on maneuvering, as a shorthand to discuss a general architecture, not all of the contextual specifics. I would be open to discussing how the contextual specifics would be applied, but to go directly to, "won't work -- specifics!..." is just throwing up roadblocks to be a pedant.

to say nothing of its ability to navigate a floor strewn with (burning) debris

Which is why I mentioned the bogey and extra wheels as in the iBot.

Re: The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

#35

Post by NikolaeVarius »

porker wrote: post #28
funkaster wrote: post #3

while the Colossus looks really interesting, I think the biggest impact was the video feed. I don't have the specs, but just by quick glancing of the video, that small stream of water probably didn't help at all in this particular case. You would have to be way closer for it to be effective, or use a different pattern of water if you're trying to achieve something else (e.g. ventilation or cooling down). In any case,…

The Colossus is "Fireproof" according to the marketing website [1]. It appears to contain Lithium batteries, so how hot do you think it can get before it stops working? 1. https://www.shark-robotics.com/en/robot/colossus/

I would be extremely surprised if it didn't cool itself with the water hookup

Re: The Drones and Robots That Helped Save Notre Dame

#36

Post by gpm »

porker wrote: post #28
funkaster wrote: post #3

while the Colossus looks really interesting, I think the biggest impact was the video feed. I don't have the specs, but just by quick glancing of the video, that small stream of water probably didn't help at all in this particular case. You would have to be way closer for it to be effective, or use a different pattern of water if you're trying to achieve something else (e.g. ventilation or cooling down). In any case,…

The Colossus is "Fireproof" according to the marketing website [1]. It appears to contain Lithium batteries, so how hot do you think it can get before it stops working? 1. https://www.shark-robotics.com/en/robot/colossus/

If they're using the water that's flowing through that hose to cool it, it could be fine with a very high external temperature. I think I would be more concerned about the cameras than the batteries, they're harder to cool.
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