LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise • Hacker News Board

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#101

Post by owyn » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 1:33 AM UTC

jonknee wrote: post #97

owyn wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like a pretty good result for 30% in additional funding. According to wikipedia, the federal gov't only provides 8% (or maybe 10%, I saw some different numbers) of the total budget for primary education at the moment... Total spending (federal+state+local) is apparently around $620B so an additional ~30% kick from the federal government would add $180B for a total of around $800B. Is that worth it? The mil…

Funding varies wildy based on location as it comes from local property taxes. Not all schools would need such increases. Thanks to that local funding scheme, the US tends to spend the most on the kids that need it the least.

Right, implicit but unsaid was the thought that the federal gov't could cover that funding gap so that all schools got the same budget regardless of the local conditions. Of course given the political forces that created the current local conditions in the first place, that's probably unlikely too.

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#102

Post by jrumbut » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 1:33 AM UTC

somethoughts wrote: post #79

I've often wondered about the effectiveness of donations to supplemental after school/summer time tutoring/coaching in under-performing school districts [1][2] versus donations to full time, private charter schools such as this one. It seems supplemental after school/summer time solutions would build on the existing public school system and fill in the gap between 3pm-6pm and during summer where they are likely to be…

This is not a charter school or private school, it is a public school that received additional money on top of its usual funding from Lebron James.

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#103

Post by ghda » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 1:36 AM UTC

Segregating students by ability is one of the easy, cheap, sensible ways to improve outcomes that almost certainly works. Taking slower students out and teaching them at their own pace should benefit those taken out and those left behind.

Unfortunately, it’s my understanding that this sort of thing winds up politically impossible in most parts of the US, as segregated-by-ability classrooms wind up looking uncomfortably like segregated-by-race classrooms.

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#104

Post by TaylorAlexander » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 1:45 AM UTC

ericd wrote: post #99

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, America, the country where we take pride in the fact that a few school children will be bailed out of a broken system by some rich folks who want to see change. Let’s not get caught up in why this is needed or the millions of students who haven’t been so lucky. America is proof that rich people can make the lives of a few people better! /sarcasm

This is an experiment to try something and show that it can work. Then, local governments/school boards can use it as an example and copy some of the successful pieces at larger scale. Your cynicism about rich people helping just a few is unwarranted here.

I agree with you and with the OP. It’s great that LeBron is doing this experiment. Maybe it will better show people that investing in students is worthwhile. But at the same time, I’m frustrated at the way we’ve let this happen. Why do we have some public schools with such poor performance? It’s right there in the results this school is seeing. The school succeeds at serving this community because the people need relief. The article mentions how some of the students parents are taking classes at the school too. The school offers free food and clothing to any parents who need it.

Do you know why the school offers free food and clothes to parents, and why that’s making a difference here? Because the parents can’t afford enough healthy food, and giving them food helps them and their children do better. But seriously, why do we have children and adults who are so unable to feed themselves that they can’t think straight?

Our economy has utterly failed these people, or perhaps was never meant to serve them. And if a philanthropist has to give them groceries, it sounds like the food stamp system hasn’t been enough either.

Don’t mistake my outrage for cynicism.

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#105

Post by nopinsight » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 2:01 AM UTC

Two major and quite distinctive improvements of the school I noticed from the article:

* Improving parental involvement and the parents’ attention to their own education

* Utilizing the hidden power of role models: LeBron James and each kid’s parents

Students spend significantly more time at home than at school. Parents interact with each kid one-on-one or in a small group. Thus, they can have much more influence than teachers on the kid’s attitude, motivation, and habits regarding education.

If we look at a broader picture, most countries that do well in PISA, an international assessment of academic skills for school students, strongly value education at every level of society starting from parents and family. This includes Vietnam, a relatively poor country which, at rank 22, does better than quite a few Western European ones.

The US, at rank 31, should study this school and expand on good lessons learned from the experiment.

[1] PISA results map http://factsmaps.com/pisa-worldwide-ranking-average-score-of...

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#106

Post by krastanov » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 2:05 AM UTC

ghda wrote: post #103

Segregating students by ability is one of the easy, cheap, sensible ways to improve outcomes that almost certainly works. Taking slower students out and teaching them at their own pace should benefit those taken out and those left behind. Unfortunately, it’s my understanding that this sort of thing winds up politically impossible in most parts of the US, as segregated-by-ability classrooms wind up looking uncomfortab…

On the other hand, Finland is often touted as having a great educational system and they very explicitly do not segregate by ability, rather they try to lift all boats. The problem of "smart kids getting bored or not having opportunities to excel" somehow does not seem to be an issue (I am a bit confused that this is the case).

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#107

Post by cageface » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 2:09 AM UTC

cageface wrote: post #92

mindfulplay wrote: post #61

It's a shame that a private citizen has do this. Reflects poorly on our country that the economically disadvantaged really do not have a choice or a voice. And these are not people who choose to be poor or incapable. They really don't have any other option.

All the current left/right political dogfighting and cultural warfare is a smokescreen for what's really going on, which is a class war. And the rich are winning. Unfortunately it seems increasingly likely that in their limitless greed they are destroying the fabric of the society that made it possible for them to become so wealthy. Sadly, history seems to keep repeating this theme down the centuries.

Wealth in the US is increasingly and extremely concentrated at the very top. Class mobility is lower in the US than it is in most developed countries. If you're downvoting this like a robot then congratulations, you bought into the phony narratives.

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#108

Post by ehsankia » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 2:12 AM UTC

icelancer wrote: post #11

shhehebehdh wrote: post #6

I didn’t see anything about this in the article, so I ask here in the hopes that someone more knowledgeable can comment: how are they controlling for selection bias? Is there any way to select into or out of this school, or is it purely the standard districting system? Even if it’s the latter in many other places it’s still possible to move into the area. Do we know to what extent that has been happening? Edit: Oops,…

There is selection bias for sure; except it works in the opposite way regarding successful outcomes. IPS takes low-performing individuals and puts them in a lottery system. This differs from a charter school or other alternative schools that skirt responsibility of special needs kids... but it should bear mention that IPS is not without controversy. The lottery system causes a lot of strife in eligible-but-unpicked i…

Are the costs of these schools similar to that of a normal school, per student?

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#109

Post by philwelch » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 2:15 AM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #66

mindfulplay wrote: post #61

It's a shame that a private citizen has do this. Reflects poorly on our country that the economically disadvantaged really do not have a choice or a voice. And these are not people who choose to be poor or incapable. They really don't have any other option.

You could also say that it reflects well on our country that a private citizen was able to realize that something needed to be done differently, and then make the change themselves instead of hassling through a decades-long "change the bureaucracy" adventure while competing with seven other equally motivated individuals who also want to change the education system, but in completely different ways...

999 out of 1000 private citizens are forced to do exactly that. It's to LeBron's credit that he recognized and properly used his influence and fame to achieve this, but he is in a rare position.

Re: LeBron James school that was considered an experiment is showing promise

#110

Post by Danieru » Tue, Apr 16, 2019, 2:18 AM UTC

owyn wrote: post #101

jonknee wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funding varies wildy based on location as it comes from local property taxes. Not all schools would need such increases. Thanks to that local funding scheme, the US tends to spend the most on the kids that need it the least.

Right, implicit but unsaid was the thought that the federal gov't could cover that funding gap so that all schools got the same budget regardless of the local conditions. Of course given the political forces that created the current local conditions in the first place, that's probably unlikely too.

If you make the federal government cover all equalization you'll find rich areas lowering their property taxes.

Other nations handle education at state or federal level from the start. If you want a federal equalization you will want it to come with a admin union as well.