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Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

mdedge.com

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Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#21

Post by rzzzt »

petercooper wrote: post #18

As someone who has used propranolol on and off over the past few years, the thing that intrigues me here is that propranolol works well in this instance due to crossing the blood/brain barrier as opposed to other beta blockers that do not. The use of beta blockers in anxiety is commonly associated with reducing the effects of stress on heart rate and blood pressure, not necessarily on affecting the brain directly whi…

I also thought before reading the article that it "just" relieves the person of the stress response happening elsewhere in the body, disconnecting it from the perceived danger.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#22

Post by keerthiko »

cgriswald wrote: post #13
Benjamin_Dobell wrote: post #10

> The propranolol must be given within roughly an hour before to 1 hour after therapeutic reactivation of the fear memory to be effective. [...] when subjects were rechallenged 12 hours after taking propranolol the previous day – that is, after a night’s sleep – the fear memory was gone Oh wow, I'd be keen to give it a go: 1. Standing next to an edge of a tall building. 2. In a tightly enclosed space.

The idea of not having a fear of heights is generating a mild anxiety in me.

I believe normal people like me are still wary of danger, and even have physical responses (tensing up, moving gingerly, holding your breath) when under the illusion of danger even when logically knowing there's very little danger, such as when standing on a transparent balcony floor or walkway of a very very tall building, or preparing for a drop from a tall roller coaster. I think that's all the physiological response one needs without getting psychologically crippled, paralyzed, making rash decisions, or just generally having a bad time when presented with these situations.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#23

Post by gchamonlive »

This is also pictured in NOVA: memory hackers on Netflix (last accessed in Brazil, in case it is region locked). It documents the process of treating arachnophobia in a patient that clearly has an extreme aversion to spiders and it is incredible.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#24

Post by [deleted] »

oskarpearson wrote: post #7
miguelrochefort wrote: post #2

> The researchers next conducted a randomized, double-blind clinical trial in 45 individuals with arachnophobia. Fifteen received 40 mg of propranolol after spending 2 minutes in proximity to a large tarantula, 15 got placebo, and another 15 received propranolol without exposure to a tarantula. One week later, all patients who received propranolol with spider exposure were able to approach and actually pet the tarant…

Please refrain from simply quoting the article, adding nothing to the conversation. It’s a blatant attempt at upvote harvesting from the TLDR crowd, and doesn’t belong on HN

[deleted]

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#25

Post by miguelrochefort »

oskarpearson wrote: post #7
miguelrochefort wrote: post #2

> The researchers next conducted a randomized, double-blind clinical trial in 45 individuals with arachnophobia. Fifteen received 40 mg of propranolol after spending 2 minutes in proximity to a large tarantula, 15 got placebo, and another 15 received propranolol without exposure to a tarantula. One week later, all patients who received propranolol with spider exposure were able to approach and actually pet the tarant…

Please refrain from simply quoting the article, adding nothing to the conversation. It’s a blatant attempt at upvote harvesting from the TLDR crowd, and doesn’t belong on HN

The article is behind a paywall and I thought this snippet properly summarized it.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#26

Post by johnisgood »

These effects are due to the fact that it readily crosses the BBB because of its high lipophilicity. It is also responsible for various other CNS side-effects such as: brain fog, sedation, vivid dreams, sleep disturbances, and rarely, depression and short-term memory issues. In contrast, low lipid solubility is associated with a lower incidence of CNS adverse effects due to the fact that it makes it difficult to cross the BBB.

Additionally, these effects may actually elicit anxiety in some individuals (especially those who get anxious over changes in their mental state and whatnot), which in turn also affects its effects on the heart rate. In such cases hydrophilic beta-blockers would do the job. I prefer labetalol as it has alpha-blocking properties and counters the catecholamine-induced (from anxiety) alpha stimulation which contributes to the increased heart rate as well.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#27

Post by IAmGraydon »

Is there some way to see this without the paywall?

I realize I’m just one data point, but as someone with anxiety, I studied up on the use of propranolol in fear extinction and was able to get my doctor to prescribe it around 5 years ago. It had absolutely no positive effect on me. I may as well have been taking aspirin. It did, however seem to have some negative effects on my memory. If I met someone while on it, I would often not recognize them if we met again. It’s like it prevented my brain from recording their face to my long term memory.

I was on nothing else but blood pressure medication, by the way.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#28

Post by ransom1538 »

petercooper wrote: post #18

As someone who has used propranolol on and off over the past few years, the thing that intrigues me here is that propranolol works well in this instance due to crossing the blood/brain barrier as opposed to other beta blockers that do not. The use of beta blockers in anxiety is commonly associated with reducing the effects of stress on heart rate and blood pressure, not necessarily on affecting the brain directly whi…

If you are out there and suffer daily 'stage fright' or serious social anxiety - propranolol is the drug for you. That weird fear that sweeps over you before a conversation - just doesn't happen. Need to talk in front of 50 people in 25 minutes? No problem. If you are crippled by social anxiety - this pill will turn you into Bradley Cooper in Limitless.

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#29

Post by ada1981 »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #5
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #3

Incredible, amazing, wonderful -- and a bit scary. Imagine this being used to erase more complex memories, like that person you dated for two weeks that broke your heart.

No knowledge is lost, just the emotional reaction.

How would it work if instead of thinking of spiders, you thought of your wife?

Would you lose your feelings of love?

This seems like an incredible drug, I’d like to do some self experimentation.

Also, if people have been taking this for anxiety, why haven’t they been cured?

Re: Single-dose propranolol tied to ‘selective erasure’ of anxiety disorders

#30

Post by IAmGraydon »

ransom1538 wrote: post #28
petercooper wrote: post #18

As someone who has used propranolol on and off over the past few years, the thing that intrigues me here is that propranolol works well in this instance due to crossing the blood/brain barrier as opposed to other beta blockers that do not. The use of beta blockers in anxiety is commonly associated with reducing the effects of stress on heart rate and blood pressure, not necessarily on affecting the brain directly whi…

If you are out there and suffer daily 'stage fright' or serious social anxiety - propranolol is the drug for you. That weird fear that sweeps over you before a conversation - just doesn't happen. Need to talk in front of 50 people in 25 minutes? No problem. If you are crippled by social anxiety - this pill will turn you into Bradley Cooper in Limitless.

Maybe I’m an outlier, but it had absolutely no effect on me for public speaking or social situations. I was prescribed a lot of it, tried for years and even still have some sitting around. I envy those who get the effects you describe.
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