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EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

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141–150 of 222 posts

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#141
post #19

In situations with notice-and-takedown like this, I always wonder why there aren't stronger protections against abuse. Should a platform or user who had their content ordered removed in error be able to receive damages? Should the lawyers or civil servants instigating these notices be disciplined for issuing erroneous, improper, or overly broad takedown notices be disciplined or blacklisted?

That's how governments work. If you're the president and do something blatantly unconstitutional, the worst case is it gets overturned in the courts. If you're a citizen, you go to jail or worse.

Why else would you pursue a role in a system of abuse than to abuse and profit?

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#142
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is implied that the parent comment was talking about illegal drugs. Interesting side fact: unlike in english, there are two completely distinct words for illegal and legal drugs in russian language. Which a lot of times makes it easier to spot russian-speaking posters, as they tend to refer to illegal drugs as just "drugs", while referring to legal ones using other more specific terms, like "pills" or something el…

> Interesting side fact: unlike in english, there are two completely distinct words for illegal and legal drugs in russian language. German is the same: "Drogen" = illegal drugs like cannabis, "Medizin" = medicine. For Germans learning English, "drug store" may sound confusing until one learns about the various distinct meanings of the word "drug" in English.

In Greece, when I asked a waiters for directions to a drug store they all made big eyes until I said the German word which is probably derrived from the Greek αποθήκη. It was quite funny.

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#143
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not for anyone outside of the EU, and not in short-term. However, I believe that it is an alarming tendency that can cause a lot of damage over a sufficiently long time period.

It's still a problem for us in the U.S, because there are always politicians in the U.S. that look at dumb things being done in Europe and say, "We should be doing that, too.", and voters who will vote for them.

In the long term, though, it could cause noticible implosion of related industries. I'm kinda imagining that this kind of regulation is going to be so clearly harmful that its removed.

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#144
post #93
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a complete mess. The MPs in office overwhelmingly oppose Brexit. They don't support anything else, but they oppose Brexit as well. But the country is fairly evenly divided. However the Conservative party hung itself out to dry on a promise to deliver Brexit, and the Conservative base very strongly wishes that Brexit had happened already. If it doesn't, it is not impossible that the Conservative party will fall…

Honestly, this is a reflection of my greatest fear of the modern world - cuts to education and social services from the last generation of Regan/Thatcher-nomics has both cut western countries economies off at the ankles while simultaneously saddling us with an overwhelming majority of unquestioning individuals that are happy to go along with whatever they are told. I don't know how the west will recover from this but…

You seem to be assuming that more education implies better informed voters which implies no Brexit.

But it was the best 'educated' voters who took the dire economic warnings of the cost of voting leave most seriously, which have since been proven false (e.g. no 800,000 lost jobs due to uncertainty post-vote).

So there's an easy argument to make that huge numbers of remain voters were just, as you put it, "unquestioning individuals that are happy to go along with whatever they are told" i.e. they were to vote remain or else economic disaster, didn't question it despite the obvious holes in this story, and did as they were told. Leave voters thought for themselves, concluded the risks were exaggerated and didn't do as they were told.

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#145

What exactly is "terrorist content?" Do calls to arms from the American Revolution against England count? What about other revolutions of the past?

Yes, I would say that anyone calling for armed revolution would be classified as a terrorist by the government they opposed.

Governments tend not to take sides against other governments unless they want to go to war with them in some way. So you can imagine that in many cases most other governments would back the terrorist label.

This points out one of the big issues with the use of the word "terrorist" in today's world. It is a label that dominant organizations use against any group that presents a serious threat, regardless of the activities of that group.

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#147
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there are many things that an American could say that would see them brought before the courts. Unless it's libel (i.e. intentional or neglectful causing of actual harm to a person) or speech connected to specific lawless action (like saying "let's whack this guy" to a contract killer) - no, there's not. Which things do you mean? > Germans in particular are acutely aware of the disastrous consequences of allowing i…

>Unless it's libel (i.e. intentional or neglectful causing of actual harm to a person) or speech connected to specific lawless action (like saying "let's whack this guy" to a contract killer) - no, there's not. Which things do you mean? It's quite a long list. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_free_speech_exce...

No, it's not a long list - most of it either specific examples of lawless acts connected to speech, or matters unrelated to freedom of speech - such as that lying to a government official is a crime. It's true, but it has nothing to do with freedom of speech - the crime here is not the words being spoken but government official being deceived. Then goes discussion of IP rights - which also not violation of freedom of speech, because again the problem here not the speech itself but that the block of information conveyed by it is owned by somebody else. Concept of ownership of blocks of information may seem weird, but that question is very different from freedom of speech.

Only limitations on obscenity somehow approach free speech restrictions, but even then they are "place and manner" restrictions, not outright bans - as you might be perfectly aware, there's a lot of porn of most obscene varieties around, and it's completely legal - as long as it is not presented in specific venues in specific manner.

All these things are radically different from what EU is trying to do. They try to ban certain things completely, based on their content - not ban publication of X because it's copyrighted, or because they want to only be transmitted by cable TV and not public broadcast, or not shown in public places where kids may see it, or not being told to government officials if this can interfere with their functions. No. They want it to be banned because of its content, totally and absolutely. There's no connection to any other crime required, there's no other harm or action required - the speech content itself is a crime. That's the fundamental difference.

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#148
post #26

Funny how exactly EU follows the path Russia has recently taken. After Russia passed the law that banned online material promoting terrorist content, suicide, drug information and harm to children, and so on, there was an avalanche of false takedown requests and misidentifications, including attempting to block Wikipedia, ban Bhagavad Gita commentary (yes, really) and many more anecdotes that sound funny unless you l…

I think we’re still a long way before we reach the excess of Russia regarding free speech et subordination of democratic values.

EU is certainly not yet where Russia is. But it's walking the same road, and stepping on the same rakes on the way. How long does it take depends on how complacent EU citizens would be when they freedoms are taken away. So far the answer seems to be "quite so", but maybe when people start being fined and jailed and sites like Internet Archive start being blocked some of them would wake up?

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#149
post #26

Funny how exactly EU follows the path Russia has recently taken. After Russia passed the law that banned online material promoting terrorist content, suicide, drug information and harm to children, and so on, there was an avalanche of false takedown requests and misidentifications, including attempting to block Wikipedia, ban Bhagavad Gita commentary (yes, really) and many more anecdotes that sound funny unless you l…

I think we’re still a long way before we reach the excess of Russia regarding free speech et subordination of democratic values.

Spain banned speech critical of the government several years ago, and several people have been jailed already. At least one person has been jailed over a tweet.

Europe isn’t one big whole, parts of it are already obviously worse than others.

Re: EU Agencies Falsely Report More Than 550 Archive.org URLs as Terrorist Content

#150

It's very sad to see the path the EU has chosen to follow in regards to speech and the free flow of ideas.

It's a path that pre-dates the EU. We're a crowded continent with a huge amount of diversity and a long and bitter history of war. We have learned through bitter experience that, while free speech is a precious right, it is also an extremely dangerous one in the wrong circumstances. Germans in particular are acutely aware of the disastrous consequences of allowing incitement to go unchallenged. Free speech is not unc…

I used to think the same. However, I see that this fear has become a technique to crush anything else that doesn't follow the same thinking. As usual, extremes are not good, no matter what, and it is in such situations that other extremes take shape.
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